Ep. 77: Lit Chats: Talking Books with Tanisha

Join Amanda and Kelsey and special guest Tanisha Brandon-Felder from Talking Books with Tanisha, an educator and BookTuber, as they share insights into their reading habits, the significance of diverse literature, and Tanisha’s journey as a writer. Discover must-read YA books and innovative ways to engage students in literacy!

00:00 Welcome to Lit Vibes Only

00:19 Follow Us on Social Media

02:19 Introducing Our Guest: Tanisha Brandon-Felder

03:08 Our Current Reads

07:34 Interview 

59:57 Lit It or Quit It: Rapid Fire

01:02:57 Closing Remarks and Social Media Plugs

Follow us on TikTok & Youtube @litvibesonlypodcast and on Instagram @litvibesonly_podcast. You can also email us at litvibesonlypodcast@gmail.com We'd love to hear from you!

See you on Mondays!

Transcript

Welcome to Lit Vibes Only

Amanda 0:03

Welcome to Lit Vibes Only, where we lit the shit out of books we love and hate. I'm Amanda, the insightful, thrill seeker, and historical fiction nerd.

Follow Us on Social Media

Kelsey 0:11

And I'm Kelsey, the unhinged, diehard, romantic and fantasy reader. Welcome, welcome, welcome, Welcome. Today we have an amazing guest, but before we get to that, we want to, of course, always direct you to our socials. We are on Instagram. Let's start there. Uh, Live Vibes Only podcast and TikTok and YouTube at Live Vibes Only podcast. And then we have our new platforms, fable, where Woo. We are, highlighting our lit or quit it books before the episodes come out. So you can read along with us, but you get an opportunity to decide what our lit or quit it books are. So that's really exciting. We have a few followers so far, but looking to make more friends. I am Lit Bops only dash, Kelsey and Amanda is Lip Vibes only Dash Amanda. So find us there.

Amanda 1:10

Yeah. And join our book clubs. As Kelsey mentioned, you can definitely read along with us. Yeah. If you. Our following us on our socials already. You will know that we launched book clubs for both Demon Copperhead and for Children of Blood and Bone, so you can be reading along with us and leaving your feedback. But most importantly, if you have not done so yet please rate and review us on Apple Podcasts and on Spotify. It takes no time at all. It just hit that five star rating. And if you've got a little bit of extra time, you can write a one or two sentence review for the entire podcast on Apple Podcast. Or you can comment on an episode on Spotify. So please and thank you. We really appreciate it, especially as we're well into our second year of this podcast and trying to continue building our following. So if you are not on socials, the last thing we'll say is that you can also reach out to us via our email. It's Lit Fives only podcast@gmail.com. Shoot us a quick, Hey, ask how we're doing. Tell us what you wanna hear on the podcast. Give us your feedback, recommendations, request. We love chatting with you all.

Introducing Our Guest: Tanisha Brandon-Felder

Kelsey 2:18

Yeah. So let me introduce our friend Tanisha that we have here today. We are so excited to have you here. And we know that today we're gonna be highlighting a variety of things, but one of your passion projects lately is your book Tube account called Talking. It's talking books with 10. Oh my gosh. I was like, so welcome Tanisha. Welcome.

Amanda 2:47

We're so excited that you're here. Excited

Kelsey 2:51

to get the opportunity to learn all about Tanisha and her amazing work with literacy and books in general. So yeah,

Amanda 2:59

we're so excited to have another educator on the podcast.

Kelsey 3:03

It's something we talk about all the time on the podcast.

Amanda 3:08

So one of the things that we do, Danisha at the beginning of each of our episodes is talk about the book that we are currently reading. So we're so curious. What are you reading right now?

Tanisha 3:19

So I'm reading two books right now. One book is, I always have a good book, like for work I'm reading that can, kind of help move whatever work we're doing for, and I'm reading a book for myself because I feel like you have to nurture and fill yourself too. So always balance the book I'm reading for work that also is happening to do both right now is authentic Corino, which is a book actually based on a research study that a researcher went into a school that's majority Latinx and talks about transformational education systems.

Kelsey 3:45

Wow.

Tanisha 3:45

And that's been really powerful. And also that's really powerful'cause it centers so much around the cultural way of being. So that's really amazing. Mm-hmm. And the book I'm reading for myself right now is The Best Man, which is based on the movie The Best Man.

Amanda 3:57

Oh yeah.

Tanisha 3:59

By Malcolm d Lee. And so I'm like so close like this close to finishing and as soon as I finish that today, I'm gonna find my next book. But yeah, so that's been really fun to read. I started that over the holidays. I'm almost done.

Amanda 4:08

Yeah, that sounds like such a fun read. I actually didn't know, so the book came first, then the movie. Okay. I did not

Tanisha 4:14

in the book, like who knew? Like he wrote a oh book based off the movie. Yeah. Okay. So it's three years later, which is like such an interesting timeline, but yeah. Yeah, so it's really cool.

Amanda 4:22

Awesome. Thank you for sharing. I, so we're recording this in January, listeners, which is my birthday month. And I just picked up my birthday book from my favorite Seattle bookstore, which is Elliot Bay. So I'm finally, I'm gonna hold it up for folks on YouTube. I'm gonna finally read my first Frederick Bachman book, my friends, this book has been all over everywhere and I've heard so many good things about it. It has, I think like a 4.4 rating on Good Reads. So I'm excited to check him out. I've heard so much about this author and I've never read anything by him. And he's this huge New York Times bestselling author. I will keep y'all posted and I will definitely be posting a review on our socials. So again, if you're not following us, you should be.

Kelsey 2.0 5:06

And then I just got done with Wuthering Heights and that is our lit or quitted episode for February Uhhuh, our second one. Yeah. From Amanda. Yeah. And,

Kelsey 5:18

uh.

Kelsey 2.0 5:20

I was glad to be done. I'll say,

Amanda 5:25

and it's interesting we're flip-flopping our recording session. So even though this episode's dropping after our Weathering Heights episode, we technically haven't recorded it yet. So I haven't had a chance to

Kelsey 5:37

hear my opinion,

Amanda 5:38

but I now I have a little sliver I think, of where that conversation's gonna go. Yeah, I read that book. Oh, Amanda, it might surprise you. Okay. I hope so. I read that book, gosh, over a decade ago. I think I was either still in college or right after and it was for fun. Like I wasn't having to read it for class. Yeah. And I really loved it. Have you read Weathering Heights, Isha?

Kelsey 5:58

I have not read it.

Amanda 5:59

Okay. I told

Kelsey 6:00

you Amanda, I loved Jane Eyre.

Amanda 6:02

Yeah.

Kelsey 6:03

I love Jane Eyre. And it's another Bronte sisters book. Uhhuh. Yeah. But and it was like similar, like dark or whatever. It's a

Amanda 6:09

similar genre. Yeah. It's the same genre.

Kelsey 6:10

But yeah, I think what's bothering me lately are audiobook, narrators. Oh, I'm struggling with some of them and so we'll see. We'll talk about, yeah, a bad already had an opportunity to listen to that episode, but we'll talk about it in just a little bit. Yes.

Amanda 6:29

And we've talked before about how a bad audiobook narrator can really just destroy a great book. It's, or how a good one can make a mediocre book amazing. So it really can go both ways. Are you a big audiobook person, Tanisha?

Tanisha 6:44

No, I think, I really like to be like on a couch with my book, like with my mm-hmm. Book, and then when I'm driving I get so lost in people's descriptions. I don't focus on what I'm like driving to. So I haven't figured out the audiobook part yet for me. Yeah,

Interview

Amanda 6:56

that was my journey this past year in 2025, because I was not an audiobook. Person, not a great auditory processor. And I decided like that was gonna be my focus last year to try and get more into audiobooks because I was the same. I was like, I can't focus on driving and also listening to what's going on. I'm gonna get easily distracted. I have a DHD. But I've realized, I have realized the more that I've done it, the easier it has become. So I feel like I'm building that muscle. But it was a challenge. It was definitely a challenge at the beginning. All right. Well let's dive in.'cause I'm so curious to learn more about you and what you do. I know you and Kelsey already have an established friendship. So we'd love to start off and give you the opportunity to share with us how you would describe yourself really at the intersection of being a reader, a writer, and an educator. So many titles in there.

Tanisha 7:53

Okay. Let's see. So I feel like the educator part of me, one since I was five years old, I knew I was gonna be a teacher, like I always knew. And I've always like had that thing. And I think it always centered around, like me reading to my dolls and like setting up, the little chalkboards and everything and having stories and then comprehension questions and like all those things. Mm-hmm. I think that came from just always having books around my house. Like my mom was like, just always like, we're gonna have books everywhere. So I had a library in my bedroom. Oh. I always had access, like to books throughout the house and I was one, one of those kids that just reading came naturally to me. So I never really struggled with reading. And so I always had this kind of yearning and like eagerness around stories. Mm-hmm. And then I think that the piece around the writer was really around wanting to tell stories that I feel like sometimes I couldn't see for myself. Like I didn't have a super dramatic childhood. Like it was pretty like. A standard existence. But we're from, my family's from the south. We were, I was raised in California and we were just like a family that was, just trying like, you know, thriving, all the kind of things. But sometimes the stories that I would read about myself, like the ones that were my culture or my race was like dramatic, there's these things that had to happen. And it was like, sometimes you can actually just have a group of friends going to school and the drama is who likes you or who doesn't like you that day, yeah. That's where the writing came in is I just wanted to tell stories about stuff people go through, things I was going through.

Amanda 9:12

Mm-hmm.

Tanisha 9:13

Yeah.

Amanda 9:14

And then how does the writer piece tie into that?'cause you mentioned reader and educator.

Tanisha 9:19

Yeah. I think this happened like when I, in eighth grade I had a teacher that really actually in sixth grade I had a teacher that assigned a assignment around like writing mm-hmm. To whenever, to write a short story. When I finished my writing project, she accused me of cheating, she, excuse me, of copying my book. It was based on the My Dolls. It was basically this whole like world that I created that I was really proud of, but it took away the excitement and like the joy around it because of the way that she was so sure. I couldn't have been the one to write it.

Kelsey 9:45

Mm-hmm.

Tanisha 9:46

But I didn't write for a while. And then eighth grade, my teacher, my only black, the first bachelor I ever had was in eighth grade, Ms. Riley. And she assigned us to write another short story and she read it and automatically was like, what can we do to help support this? Wow. It was so encouraging.

Kelsey 10:00

Mm-hmm.

Tanisha 10:01

But she only was there until October school started, at the beginning of September. And so she ended up getting another position somewhere. And that nurturing went away. But my desire never went away. Like I knew then that it was possible, and so I just started writing. But I think what kind of turned me into wanting to make my writing more public was when my brother unfortunately passed away in a pretty unfortunate situation. And he had a list of things he really wanted to accomplish before he got to whatever age and he was pretty young when he died. Mm-hmm. And I realized I had not pushed my own writing forward. Like I hadn't done some of the things that I really wanted to do.

Kelsey 10:35

Yeah.

Tanisha 10:35

And so writing became this like, I mean, I always had been journaling, so journaling was something that was really natural to me. Mm-hmm. And then wanting to see things like on a shelf that some other little person could pick up and be like, yeah, I really wanna read this story'cause the story, feels like so good. Or I'm learning something or it's hard to read, but I also like, will feel better, when I finish reading it. And the joy of sharing words and like sharing stories, like that's where that came from. Yeah, absolutely. Yeah.

Kelsey 10:59

Mm-hmm. Yeah. That's so sweet. So it sounds like you've been a lifelong reader Yes. From like, when you were itty bitty. Yeah. Do you remember a book that made you fall in love with reading or was it like or was it not a book? Was it something else in general?

Tanisha 11:16

Yeah, so a book that stood out to me was this book. There's lot, there were always lots of books, but there was one book that I loved and I read it over and over again when I was like little. Mm-hmm. And that was called but No Elephants. Oh, okay. And it was about this little lady that had this house and she would welcome all these animals to come into her house. And she made her house so welcoming, but her rule was like, but no elephants absolutely not. And then one day this big elephant came and it was so like, I really wanna come in. Is there any way I can come in? And she was like, no, no elephants. No elephants. And finally something happened to, help her bring the elephant in. And the elephant came up kind of like, you know, almost destroyed the house. It was so big and the house was so tiny.

Kelsey 11:53

Mm-hmm.

Tanisha 11:53

But then everything worked out. And I just remember like reading like that I, for some reason, I really identify with that elephant. I was like, I know what that feels like. Not to be sometimes, always welcome in certain places. Yeah. But also, it was one of those stories that just captured you. So that was like my little itty bitty story. I think I was like maybe four or five when I read that book over and over again. Mm-hmm. But when I like truly fell in love with like chapter books was when I was like in third grade in, I remember this so clearly. It was my first scholastic book order, whatever, right? Mm-hmm. It was like my first book I ever got was Tales of a Fourth Grade, nothing by Judy Bloom. Oh, okay. And it was, I was eight years old and I was, okay, I'm not in fourth grade, but I really wanna read this book. And I like, and I was so ready. And yeah, like that is what turned it for me. Like after that it was like every Judy Bloom book ever, I'm gonna read it. Yeah. And then after that it was like, what other books feel like Judy Bloom or Feel like those kind of stories And I just like just kept going.

Amanda 12:47

Yeah.

Tanisha 12:47

Yeah.

Amanda 12:48

It's so interesting talking to folks who, you know, really, especially if they were. Young readers who fell in love at a young age versus like someone who got into it at adulthood. Yeah. What they're attracted to and then what they continued to pursue all the way up because as you were answering, I was like, what was my book or books that I was really into towards series. And I remember, especially in middle school, I was very much into Nancy Drew and the Hardy Boys, probably the Hardy Boys a little bit more. And like anything involving mysteries, a little bit of thriller. And that is, for me, is still true today. Like that's still one of my top genres. And then I was also into the Dear America Oh yeah. Diaries. And also like American Girl stories and I love historical fiction. And it's that never changed for me. Like that initial, like these are the kind of stories that I love to read and interact with and write. That didn't waiver. Yeah. Even into adulthood. So, We are all, based here in Seattle and. We are curious to know how this city in particular has shaped your relationships to books and or community literacy.

Tanisha 14:01

I think Seattle's like the best city for readers. Oh, okay. I'm enjoying it. I think for me, what I have really appreciated is like the abundance of small bookstores that you can find, which just, I mean, I have a favorite, my favorite right now'cause I live like not too far from Burien, is page 2 books, right? Downtown Burien, old Town Burien. Okay. And it's a book that no matter when I go in, I'm always gonna find a book that I want, like always.

Kelsey 14:27

Oh. Mm-hmm. I

Tanisha 14:27

also love Elliot Bay. I also love third place books. Those are bookstores where like I go in like I know, okay, I'm gonna find a place to be able like this, to browse. No one's gonna bother me. And they might help me if I ask for help and everything, but they're also gonna be like, like just welcoming and I really love that.

Kelsey 14:40

Mm-hmm.

Tanisha 14:42

And I feel like I've been able to find access to most of the authors that I read have come here, like for book talks for town halls. And so I feel like I have access to the authors that I really wanna ask more questions to or really wanna hear more about that. I really appreciate that kind of vibe. Mm-hmm. I also, the fact that we have some pretty, strong local authors so I wanted to remember'cause a couple of them are ones that just stand out to me that I've read or also like really appreciate having conversations with is like Jewel Parker Rhodes and she's amazing. And her stories, mixed between historical fiction and just like things that are happening currently. Diana Ma Jesse Hi, and Erin Jones, Octavia Butler of course. Some really amazing authors that I feel like have the context down. Like Renee Watson's not too far. Just stuff like that, where it's yeah. We have this kind of like cultural vibe to it. So I really enjoyed that part of it. Although I have to say. When I travel, I always find a bookstore. I always wanna know what Yes, life is. Of course. Yeah. But that's like how I feel like for Seattle. And I feel like I mean there's work to do in terms of what's happening in schools. It's a different story. Yeah. A whole different story. But in terms of what I've experienced around just enjoying like the literacy or the liter mm-hmm. Like the literary kind of like environment. Like I've really been enjoying that piece.

Amanda 15:57

Mm-hmm. Yeah. And I think one of the things about Seattle too, and maybe other cities are similar, but I think to this like growth of really niche bookstores that are focused on a particular genre. Yeah. We back in December. Had to sit down with a local bookstore owner of a romance bookstore in Pioneer Square, pioneer Squared Beguiled books. And we have bookstores here in Seattle that are focused on like horror and that are focused on like more STEM based books. And that to me is a relatively new development. And again, maybe other cities are also like on that track. I'm not sure, but I think that's something also that Seattle does a really good job of.

Kelsey 16:39

Yeah. And then even mom's books in the international district is like Asian owned bookstore. Mm-hmm. Another like niche area. Yeah. I love it.

Amanda 16:49

I wonder if it's because of the weather here, because we have these long gray, rainy winters that just inspire you to curl up inside.

Tanisha 16:59

Yeah I was in a Boba tea shop the other day, like in the federal area and like I walk, you know, they have a whole like book theme. Oh yeah. Bob Tea. This is so cute. So yeah, just like little things like that. Yeah.

Amanda 17:11

It's such a vibe here. Kelsey and I, again, I think this is maybe also back in December, there's a new book themed cocktail bar in, I believe it's Ballard, right? Yeah. Called the Ink Drinker that we went to and yeah, it's really just meant for all of us bookworms to go and have a bite and a cocktail and read. It's fantastic. Love it.

Kelsey 17:31

Yeah. And then down the street from that is Swoon City in Ballard as well, which is another romance bookstore, but they also highlight. And do events where it's like crafting events. Oh, nice. Yeah, definitely. Yeah. Yeah. I wanna look into their groups to see if any of them are interesting to me. Yeah. I think I agree with you, Tanisha. Like it does feel like Seattle is definitely like a literary bubble that we've created here. And there's so many opportunities for us to connect with other readers mm-hmm. With authors even to add to your list of authors EG Ooma, right? Oh, that's right. Yeah. Yeah. She's an amazing author and I love her work, and she's just she's right here. That's crazy. Yeah. So switching gears a little bit from like our Seattle based area, you let me know that ya is like your favorite genre or collection of types of books because it's not technically a genre, right? It's a category. Yeah. So what do you think ya does better than other categories of books?

Tanisha 18:46

There's something about the way that stories are cared for, and I think it might be because the characters are young people themselves, that there's a kind of this, not protectiveness, but I think an understanding that we need to be careful with how we're telling this story.

Kelsey 19:00

Mm-hmm.

Tanisha 19:01

Be careful but be authentic because you never know who's gonna pick that story up and need to like. Get something from it. Learn something from it. Stories have an impact and, to change your life also. So who might be saved from it, honestly.

Kelsey 19:14

Mm-hmm.

Tanisha 19:14

And there's such like this variety of it doesn't really matter like what your identity is. I've seen so many different identities be either introduced, talked about, defined, elaborated on in ways that I think build understanding and capacity for like acceptance and empathy can lead you into other kind of genres if you're really interested in going deeper into other categories because YA can introduce you into that. What I really love about it is that. There's just so many authors with so many different perspectives that I feel like I learned a lot just from reading the books. And I feel like there's, and especially if you get cooked into an author, right? There's a couple of authors that I just like really will pretty much read anything that they write. Mm-hmm. Because I love how they story tell so much and I love how they take care of their characters. So it's just the characterizations for me is everything. I love a good character. Mm-hmm. I love a deep character arc. Like I really want people to like, join your whole world. And I love how they take time, like helping build this, like this world for you so you under, you're actually part of what's happening. And I know that happens in other books too, but there's something I think, like I said that is just careful around a careful, but I think but real mm-hmm. Around ya that is is pushing boundaries and yearning and challenging. You come with me like why not just come on, let's go. Let's figure this out. And so I've really been enjoying and I've always enjoyed ya. I never grew out of ya. Mm-hmm. And yeah, if I'm gonna go into a bookstore, I'm always going to the YA section.

Amanda 20:40

Yes. What's new? What's, I love that you kept on using the term like care or like being careful with these stories. Because if you think about the demographic that's largely reading and consuming these texts, they are at such an impressionable age, right? And they're using these texts to shape their worldview, their perception of self and others. So I feel like ya authors especially have kind of this additional burden to make sure that they're taking care of the stories that they're telling and the reader because so much of what they're sharing could have such a significant impact. On development of the folks reading their text. And I also actually, I think all three of us are huge fans of ya. We're often recommending ya books on the podcast and on our socials and reading them. But I do think adult readers there can be misconceptions, especially when they hear of other adults reading ya. So what do you feel are the misconceptions that you hear most often primarily from adults who don't read ya.

Tanisha 21:47

Yeah, but the, somehow the stories are simplified mm-hmm. That somehow the characters like are not realistic.

Kelsey 21:52

Mm-hmm.

Tanisha 21:53

Or you're reading down like, you're like, like you're reading down, it's like, what would you have find, have anything interesting or like a connection to

Kelsey 22:00

mm-hmm.

Tanisha 22:01

Yeah. It's it's almost, it's, and it reminds me actually of the whole graphic novel conversation. Yes. Graphic are not real books, like mm-hmm. Why would you say that? There's the art and craft that goes into that storytelling as well. Mm-hmm. And that's what I feel like, happens with some, my a that people are quick to dismiss'em.

Kelsey 22:16

Mm-hmm.

Tanisha 22:17

And not to take the stories and the theme seriously. Yeah. But if only like you could break past that barrier and open one up, like maybe you might be surprised, you probably would be surprised. At how much is there for everyone mm-hmm.

Kelsey 22:29

Yeah. Yeah. There's even been some, like middle school level reads that I've read that I've been like, oh my God, this is it is amazing and profound in ways and it is really unfortunate that people, like I see so often on social media, it's like, don't let the ya title like scare you or lead you to something else because it's like, why are we make, why are we trying to make excuses for it's a great category of books. Mm-hmm. And there's a wide range

Amanda 22:57

Yes.

Kelsey 22:58

Types of books you're reading in ya. So it's, yeah, it's wild. I wanna go back to the first question we asked of this in this section. You mentioned your go-to white authors. Who are some of them?

Tanisha 23:10

Okay, so Nick Stone, Nick Love, like I love Nick Stone. And I had opportunity to, it was kinda like this real random opportunity where I had a chance actually to meet her and Oh wow. I had read like almost all of her books. There's one book I have not read. She has a new book coming out like I think in a couple of months. But I've read all of her books otherwise. It was, she's one of those authors that I was introduced during COVID and just clashed onto, so Dear Martin and Dear Justice and Dear Mandy are my favorites from her specifically, but she's just amazing. Got that young voice like down. And then Jason Reynolds, I love Jason Reynolds. Okay. She's just like this. I don't know. I would love to have more time to, to spend with him. Never really, I've been his talks. Never had a chance to really talk with him directly though. Mm-hmm. Jason Reynolds, Kwame Alexander.

Kelsey 23:54

Mm-hmm.

Tanisha 23:54

Really love him. Tiffany, d Jackson, Angie Stone, Renee Watson. There's just I just, yeah. Like those are a couple of the ones that stand out right now. Oh yeah. Elise Bryant, I love Elise Bryant.

Kelsey 24:07

Mm-hmm.

Tanisha 24:08

Mm-hmm. And there's another I think her first name is Voya, A-B-O-Y-A, and I forgot her last name. But she has a couple of like wintry love books. Oh, okay. Which has been really fun to read too,

Amanda 24:19

yeah. Yeah. I was like, oh, I recognize some of those names on this list. Yeah. Like I have an Angie Stone novel behind me. Yes. One of my favorites is, have you read? And I've mentioned on this podcast several times, Elizabeth Acevedo.

Tanisha 24:34

Yes, I have. Yeah. Yeah. Love her stuff.

Amanda 24:37

Yes. And it's such a cool mixing of genres'cause it's a mix of prose and poetry and they're just so compelling and poignant. Oh my goodness.

Kelsey 24:47

I think Angela and Booley is,

Amanda 24:48

oh my gosh,

Tanisha 24:49

I forgot. I forgot. Yes, I read all of those too.

Kelsey 24:54

She was here in Vancouver, BC October maybe. I can't remember when I went, I don't know. Mm-hmm. Amanda. But it was amazing. Like it was the best book talk I've ever been to, and it was just, I was like, oh my God. I can imagine. Yeah. It was great. And I'm such a weirdo when it comes to people like I admire or I like look up to and like I've read their books or seen them on TV or whatever. Yeah.'cause I can't go talk to them because they get so nervous. Oh, same. And they say stupid things. Mm-hmm. So I wanted to go say hi, but I was like, I can't, I.

Tanisha 25:37

We'll go together.'cause like we have to talk to her. I really do

Kelsey 25:41

wanna talk to her, but God, yeah. I'm just such a weirdo.

Amanda 25:47

She is great. Kelsey got me to read Fire's Daughter and was one of my top reads.

Tanisha 25:52

Yeah. But I love that her specifically is that she has a lesson that she's gonna make sure you learn by reading her books. Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm. Youre gonna, you're gonna understand. Yep. There are some things that are happening in the indigenous culture, native culture that are important for us to pay attention to. Mm-hmm. And so that's where like the Reation pieces, like for me, for warrior Girl On Earth came up, I was like, oh, like I had no idea. Like I just not know. It makes sense. Mm-hmm. But I had no idea. And then the I forgot what it's called, but the ceremony where they take the guy in the book put him in the blanket and basically are beating him. That was for fire keeper's daughter, like

Amanda 26:23

mm-hmm.

Tanisha 26:24

Oh

Amanda 26:24

yes. Uhhuh.

Tanisha 26:25

Yeah. Oh. And then of course, like the missing and murdered, indigenous peoples movement. Mm-hmm. I just feel like every time I read her book and I've read her books a couple times now, just like, wow like, you're gonna make sure we understand, you're gonna make sure we get this. But she does it in such good storytelling. And I just finished reading like the last one this summer. And I really appreciated her going back and keeping the characters and like being authentic to their stories. And that was all about the Indian Child Welfare Act and what happens when children are lost in our system and are abused. Mm-hmm. And so just I don't even know you all, like I can't wait for her next one. And also, like each book is like, oh, like they're heavy. They

Amanda 27:00

are.

Tanisha 27:01

Ah,

Amanda 27:01

yeah,

Tanisha 27:02

I got

Kelsey 27:03

my husband into them and he read Fire Keeper's Daughter, and then in instantly put, picked up the next one. He's I gotta read. And then he was like, did you know it's the same like world? I was like, yeah, all three of them are, it was so silly. It was cute. But yeah yes, adore her books.

Amanda 27:23

Yeah. And to your point Tanisha, like a lot of ya books and again, I think adult readers Miss was like, they are addressing. Important, significant real world issues. Yeah. And I think, again, it's like, oh, they're for younger people, so they're not going to be as meaningful or complex or nuance or have that much to say. Yeah. That's gonna be relatable to me in any way. It's not gonna be educational to me in any way. And I'm like, you could not be more wrong. Yeah. There's so many important lessons to be learned in these books, regardless of age. Yeah. And if we're thinking in terms of DEIB work, like these are windows for us. And so getting a chance to look into someone else's experience and learn again regardless of the age of the protagonist.

Tanisha 28:06

That's right. That's right.

Amanda 28:08

Should not be a barrier at all. You've rattled off a list of authors that you really love and so honing in a little bit more. What are some why a books or a YA book that you wish every middle or perhaps high school student had access to and why that book or books?

Tanisha 28:27

So I'll go back to Nick Stone because so it's the Dear Martin series and it's Dear Martin. Dear Justice and Dear Manny. Mm-hmm. And the reason why I really like those books specifically, I wish that everyone had access to them, is because first it breaks down the story of what I would say, probably a middle class black youth, black boy who has friends across the spectrum in terms of like class experience. And he has a struggle, he really has to deal with in the middle of this whole thing, which is dealing with the race class being ostracized, witnessing a friend get, harassed by the police and assaulted by the police. And still have to keep going. You know what I mean? Mm-hmm. He still has to keep going. And in this book, the first book, other characters are introduced and so we have a chance, we have a chance to see that window about what is an experience for a young black boy who is like super smart, like he's very smart. He is about to go like to Princeton or Harvard or whatever. He has really great people and it's really great support system, but right around him, things are not necessarily like that, and that's a reality for him. Mm-hmm. And then we have Dear Justice, which is one of the characters that's introduced in Dear Martin, and he's an incarcerated youth. And so in Dear Martin the main character, sorry, the main character's name is Justice and Justice is writing letters to Martin Luther King as like a, an assignment. Mm-hmm. And it becomes like this practice that happens and he goes to him for advice and he goes to him for sharing things and he's struggling. Dear Justice is what's happening is the letters are being written to him from an incarcerated acquaintance that he grew up with. And this like whole huge kind of mystery thing is coming in and and what's right and what's wrong and and a white kind of like protagonist or antagonists in this. And this story that's really trying to figure out, where am I on both sides of this, this situation. Mm-hmm. And he has an arc too, right? This white mm-hmm. This white boy has an arc also. And then we have, dear Manny and dear Manny, is the story of the white protagonist. Okay. And what his connection is to the two black protagonists that have been in the other stories. And there's just something really beautiful about, like the family, the criminal justice system, the education mm-hmm. System, like what it means to have blackness, you know, at black excellence, black struggle, like white learning, white struggle. Like all that stuff is mixed into like this book, um mm-hmm. Or these books. And that's the book that I wish everyone, like that trilogy I wish everyone had access to, those books and a teacher who could hold the conversation mm-hmm. To allow students to really engage in what if and what do we know about this and how's connect like to our current reality. Mm-hmm. It is like a book that I have to read. I'm reading those books, I read them in order and I have to, I read them over and over again'cause I love them. Yeah. It's like a one time a yearbook. You go back once, once a year read this book again. Those are my, that's my series. That's my trilogy.

Amanda 31:11

That sounds so important.

Tanisha 31:14

Yeah. For folks.

Amanda 31:15

Yeah.

Tanisha 31:16

I always add that like Nick Stone talks about how in, in Dear Martin, some of the people she worked, she was working with youth who were in the juvie system and they were like, I love that story Dear Martin, it's so good. But what about our story? Like, where's our story at? We're not out there. That's not real. Yeah. Can you write a story for us? And that's where Dear Justice came from. Wow. Yeah. I just love that kind of background story too.

Amanda 31:37

Yeah. And it's not a, again, it's not a perspective you really see anywhere. Yeah. In literature especially ya. Yeah. That, that is a real lived existence. Like my passion. Yeah. It made, when you were talking, it's like what is, what are these books making me think of? And it was who you mentioned already, Jason Reynolds, because I read his book, all American Boys. Oh yeah. It was like, and a very similar kind of vein, right? Yeah. Where we're diving into that experience. And another book that I think. A lot of people should read. I think even more so, like if you are an educator listening to this podcast because of the stereotypes and stigma that a lot of us carry, the way that we interact with our black students, particularly our black male students. And so I think books like this are so important for adults, like educators of all races to read to help, check your own biases, right? And how you're perceiving your students and then therefore how you're treating them in the classroom, in the hallway, in the lunchroom. So that's like another plug for like, yes, you should be reading these books. Me too, as an adult, please. Yeah.

Kelsey 32:40

And thinking about that line of the kind of book, but expanding a little bit mm-hmm. Beyond that like what themes N Ya do you feel are most urgent for folks to read now?

Tanisha 32:55

Oh my gosh, right now in this moment, like for real the books that are pushing are towards acceptance across identities. Mm-hmm. I've been reading, another genre with NYA that I read a lot of is queer fiction and queer romance, like romcom.

Kelsey 33:06

Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm.

Tanisha 33:07

And that's where that's where that piece around the helping define, build awareness, build capacity for what is what is this world mean? I don't identify as L-G-B-T-Q, however, I feel like there are enough people in my life that do that. I wanna be able to understand and also like just hear like the normalize every day-to-day. Mm-hmm. Life of a romantic, mm-hmm. That person or any person. But I think that's one thing is like understanding that we can be humanized through stories. Mm-hmm. Yes. And so I think that some themes that I'm really loving right now are acceptance across identities. Mm-hmm. And like the openness around conversation and empathy while also pushing for yes, we're gonna have this space. We're gonna take up the space and we get to it's our space to take up. I feel like that is a theme that I'm really appreciating. You know what I mean? I think I, I think we need that, like we need to take up some space Yes. To get those stories out there and like our own identities need to be pushed and valued.

Amanda 34:00

Yeah.'cause those spaces are not just gonna be given to us. You do have to just be assertive. Like, I'm here and I'm gonna take it even if you don't give it to me

Kelsey 34:07

about you guys. But I'm really seeing that like in our youth as well. They're like, I'm just here. Mm-hmm. And there's so many identities that are new to me and I'm like, oh, y'all are teaching me. Mm-hmm. And requiring the space to be who you are. Mm-hmm. And it's even been like a journey for me. Not just reading and it, we see it right in our worlds. Yeah. Yeah, absolutely.

Amanda 34:36

Yeah. Especially as educators.'cause we're working with youth every day. Yeah. I work at a six to 12 and I teach in both the middle and vapor school. So this is my,

Kelsey 34:44

yeah,

Amanda 34:44

this is my demographic. And yeah. Complete Echo Kelsey's sentiments.'Cause like we grew up, I mean, we're millennials. Like we grew up in a different time. And even just going from our generation to, what is it? Gen is Gen Alpha, right? Gen, yeah. Gen Alpha and Gen ZI think are right. Are both the ones that are in middle school and high school right now.

Kelsey 35:04

11.

Amanda 35:06

Like showing my age. But yeah, I think I am I am really often proud of the way that our students are so bold and confident and again, claiming that space and not being. Ashamed or insecure, which was very different I think, from even when I was in school, even more so based on where I grew up, which was very, rural white Ohio. But yeah. Another reason why these books are so important for them to also see themselves. Yeah. And their experiences shared. Shifting a little bit from reading and consuming books and getting excited about them, what was the catalyst that shifted you from going from someone who was simply enjoying books to wanting to craft and write your own?

Tanisha 35:49

Mm-hmm. I've always enjoyed the act of writing, like the idea of what are the. The thoughts in my head that I can put into some kind of outline or order and put that into an actual story. And I think the more that I was reading, the more I was like, huh, I wanna try that too. Mm-hmm. I wanna try that. I think it does go back though, like to what I was saying with my brother and just realizing like you can tell your story or you don't like, it's really, that's it, that's the kind of choice you have. Either you tell the story or you do the thing you wanna do or you don't.

Kelsey 36:17

Mm-hmm. And

Tanisha 36:17

any regret that happens really is on you after that, and mm-hmm. I could talk about wanting to write or I could just write, I could to

Kelsey 36:24

it.

Tanisha 36:25

And the catalyst was literally my daughter. Was born. And then 10 days later my brother was murdered and it was like such a sudden thing in the middle of this whole like, wait, my body is like still literally trying to figure out like how to respond to this little person. Yeah. And I also don't have a brother anymore. And then my parents were in the middle of that, that whole thing. And I feel like I was also like in the middle of caretaking for my parents and also my brand new baby. And also he was in a different state, so having to go back home where we were from in California to put him to rest.

Kelsey 36:57

Mm-hmm. And in the

Tanisha 36:58

middle of all of that, it was like, there's not a lot of time to ponder do I have time to do this? Or I not have time to do this, make it happen. Mm-hmm. And I wanted that story to come out that I've been holding onto basically since my eighth grade teacher was like, you could write, you could like, you could do this. Yeah. We, it's possible. And I just started and it wasn't perfect and it's, it's not perfect, but it was something that I did because I really wanted to do and I saw it out and I, I did some things to help support myself during that, but it was therapy. It was like, it helped me, like it really helped me start moving towards healing. And then it was just like one of those things where I just here's here's one story. It is possible. Can I make space to continue? And I have not been like, consistent with always having a pattern for writing. But I've worked on it and I've been taking like, more classes and really trying to build a discipline for that. And having people around you who also are writing is really helpful. Yes. And that's something that just keeps me going. It's the stories, I'd love for them to be shared out, but I write them first for myself. They really helped me too yeah.

Kelsey 37:53

Yeah. I just wanna thank you for your openness about sharing your story. Yeah. And obviously that's a painful memory that also supported your journey. Mm-hmm. But thank you for your openness. Yeah. You're welcome. Yeah. Thinking about like your writing mm-hmm. And you, the intersection of being an educator.'cause I see it all interwoven. You're just like talking so much about I was inspired by my eighth grade teacher and it was all of these things just intersect. Mm-hmm. And how did being an educator, help shape your own writing? Yeah. Of like the characters the stories, the dialogue.

Tanisha 38:34

Yeah. It is funny. So when I was teaching sixth grade, I taught middle school for seven years. I was the sixth grade humanities teacher. So loved teaching, writing with my sixth graders. And I would try, they would be my little like Guinea pigs. Like, you know, I find this idea, what do y'all think? And gimme feedback and let me know. I wanted them first to be excited about writing. Like I wanted them to know Hey, I'm asking you to write these things I'm gonna write them too. I'm gonna write them with you. We're all in this together. But I also wanted kids not to be fearful, like some kids were fearful of putting their ideas on paper and not being perfect. And I think honestly in education this idea around perfection is so over, I'm just over it. I don't need you to be perfect. I just need you to try and I need to make sure that we have cultures and climates in our schools that are encouraging kids to like just be, let's also enjoy the fact that we're learning every single day. And that doesn't have to be this thing that becomes a burden. And so for me as an educator, when I was thinking about and thinking about, creating as a writer and even as a reader, it's every kid, and this is like back to a class I was ta I'm taking right now that really is talking about, a lot of the struggles that students are having when it comes to like just basic literacy skills. A lot of kids, will struggle with literacy, but. Technically, 95% of the kids that we are teaching have the capability or the opportunity at the beginning of their liter literacy journey to be really literate people.

Kelsey 39:55

Mm-hmm.

Tanisha 39:55

And so that tells me that something around the practice that we're doing, the way we're talking about the way we're executing or whatever, is not meeting the needs of our students. We know this, right? It's not even like rocket science or anything. And yet, like why is it so complicated all the time? So I feel like we talked more about what we are currently reading. If we did more modeling of writing with our students across content areas I've always been inspired by what's happening, with the youth. They're the ones that introduced the books to me first, you know what I mean? Yeah. It's what are you reading? Why is that so interesting? Like, how can I learn more about that? But I don't know. I think we can't like, learn above our students, we gotta learn with our students mm-hmm. And be there in the middle of that with them. And I don't know, education for me has always been like a platform for conversation, community building, advocacy building relationships. And I like the idea of doing that through the things that you love. And for me that was always like reading and writing.

Kelsey 40:46

Yeah. So

Tanisha 40:47

I always led with that. Like literally that's my classroom library was like my pride and joy. I loved it. Yeah. That was the hardest thing to get rid of or to have to pass over when I left. Mm-hmm. Teaching. And I do remember going back into my classroom like, oh, you're not really appreciating the books that I left. Let me take them back. I will take,

Kelsey 41:04

and I did because

Tanisha 41:04

if you're not gonna take care of them, I'm like, not even the students. It's it was the adults. If you're not gonna take care of'em in Valium, I will take my books back. Yeah. Yeah. And you start from scratch. I know that was petty, but like I was,

Amanda 41:15

we get it. Because stories are so important and they're so powerful. It's. We have been using stories since the dawn of time as human beings to understand our world and our place in it, and our connection to others. And if you're gonna take something that has that much power and value and not respect it and not care for it um, but yeah. I'm gonna take it back. Absolutely. Get that. And you mentioned near the beginning of this interview, part of your reading journey was looking for texts that you could see yourself mm-hmm. In. And so tying that into this moment when you are writing your books, have you ever thought like this is exactly the book that I wanted or needed? When I was a kid.

Tanisha 42:07

Yeah. When I'm currently workshopping. And floating around to like different, midterm fellowship opportunities is the book I wish I had when I was transitioning from high school to my HBCU for college. And I went to school in Louisiana, but this book is living in Atlanta so it's grounded like in Spelman and Morehouse and Clark. Mm-hmm. And that's where the characters are at. But it's that first year. It's the first year of literally like when the parent is dropping their child off and what that feels like. And I now have done that'cause my daughter just started college this year.

Kelsey 42:34

Oh wow. And

Tanisha 42:35

I felt that in a way I hadn't felt it when I was writing it. And so I've been, going back and tweaking it a bit. But oh my goodness, like the lessons that I wish someone had prepared me for was it me? Like when you're going with people that you've been really close with and your relationships start changing, like your friendships start changing'cause you're changing, and then the actual like your romantic relationships that you're involved in or starting to, explore, like what things should you be careful about? Paying attention to like in, in honor of safety for yourself, for your mind and for your body. Like all those kind of things. This is the book right now. I'm like, I wish I'd had this book when I was starting out. Like I, I would love it and it's still fun. It's just really some good stuff in there. But this is literally if I could go back in time and give myself this book, like this is the book, I would do it because yeah, there's so many lessons that I learned and things to pay attention to. And there's a lot going on in the world. It's easy for us to be, misled or have trust in the wrong people.

Amanda 43:26

Mm-hmm.

Tanisha 43:26

So yeah.

Amanda 43:27

Yeah. That's how I wish I had that book. I know that would've been very helpful in that transition period.

Kelsey 43:35

I wanna ask you, Tanisha what are the titles of your books? Oh, and I think you said two, or was it three?

Tanisha 43:42

There's two right now that, so there's two that have been self-published in the past. And then one I'm currently like, like I said, workshopping. So the two that have been self-published. One is called From a Caterpillar to a Butterfly.

Kelsey 43:52

Mm-hmm.

Tanisha 43:53

And that's about a series of friends that in their senior year of high school and different things are happening for them. And like this one girl who's really just had some just some peep some kind of hits around her self-esteem and things like, that haven't been, I'm not sure how that, sorry. Anyway, I like a thumb. But yeah, she had some hits to her self-esteem and she's trying to rebuild herself and her mom is really there to help encourage her and her best friends around mm-hmm. We are here. As you come out of that cocoon basically. Yeah. So it's that transition yeah. And then there's also a book that I wrote. So I had my daughter beige. I went through IVF, nor to have her, it took us a long time to be able to realize that we weren't gonna be able to conceive naturally mm-hmm. By the natural pro and progression of that. And so we did IVF, but I hadn't really seen a lot of stories that were talking about IVF for young people. Like for a young purpose perspective. Here's my story. I see the adoption stories for little people.

Kelsey 44:51

Mm-hmm.

Tanisha 44:52

I hadn't really heard about, a story for IVF. And so this is a story called Beige Story. Oh. And it's about her story, but through the IVF, process, which is a lot. It's a lot. So when a little baby comes out of IVF, like it's a lot of work that's gone into getting them there. Yeah. They should know that's a really special process for them. Oh, I

Kelsey 45:10

love

Tanisha 45:10

that.

Amanda 45:11

Yeah,

Kelsey 45:12

I wanna read that.

Amanda 45:14

I know, and you're right, there is a gap in the literature, so that's Yeah, definitely filling that. Oh, that sounds beautiful.

Kelsey 45:21

Definitely something that yeah, you just don't in general hear IBF stories. Mm-hmm. They are really cumbersome, can be painful, can be very long. Mm-hmm. Unless you know someone personally like you probably haven't heard yeah. Someone's story.

Amanda 45:38

Yeah.

Kelsey 45:39

So can't wait to figure out where we find those end. I love that. And I've been thinking about this whole, because you're also a mother obviously, and the part of literacy and loving books and being a writer also plays into being a mother. And like how you support your child through, through literacy. Yeah. So we're wanting to like shift gears a little bit to that and we know you're like deeply passionate about students like getting access to literacy and books and such that support them in that way. And we're wondering like, what does access mean to you?

Tanisha 46:16

Mm-hmm. Right now? Mm-hmm. I think that's been evolving for me. I'm glad you asked that question because I think first one, one layer of that is literally do kids have access to books that reaffirm who they are, that are culturally informed? And also I think opening up opportunities like to see the, like the mirrors of themselves, but also see the opportunities for things that can happen outside of themselves. So that's one of the hugest pieces for me is like. Where are we building that kind of plentiful around just opportunity to have that. Mm-hmm.

Kelsey 46:46

What

Tanisha 46:46

I'm learning more and more, and I'm really appreciating is that the other part of the access is like that literally, like who is teaching, like who has the skills to teach reading and doing that in ways that are equitable across our system. So it does not depend on who's in your class or what their background is or what their learning, capacities are. They are they are able and afforded the opportunity to have really strong literacy instruction so they can access those really beautiful books that are available. And I think there's a lot of factors that go into like why that hasn't happened, and I wish we would listen to our community. I feel like our community, our communities of color have the answers around bailing really strong literacy skills, whether it's like through oral language through storytelling, like through capturing ideas and journals, like whatever it is that we've been doing. Forever. Mm-hmm. I think we can do those things and we should be doing those things in schools too. And giving access to our community, to our classrooms, I think is a really good entry point. Give us elders, give us the lessons. Tell us what we need to be doing and help us, because obviously our school system is not like we know. Like, I mean, Even being in a school system, I understand I'm perpetuating this system of taking away access and opportunity to the students that are in the system and also trying every single day to fight that system, and not be the person that's continuously adding to that. So let's do better if I know we can do better. If I know I can do better, I wanna do better. Absolutely.

Kelsey 48:11

I'm constantly struggling with that aspect of our job. Mm-hmm. I know it's real. I'm just perpetuating this and I'm just constantly like trying to figure out that, that balance or. Yeah. I dunno. That we'll ever see that. But even I, I was just thinking about young children, right? Like when we're trying to teach them literacy I often see it'll just be like creators online where they're trying to induce like this level of joy Yeah. With learning, right? And at some point we've been losing that. I think that's an aspect too. And I see thinking about like English teachers that I've worked with, it's like, where is the joy? Like they're middle schoolers, right? Mm-hmm. Like we need that in our day to day, and I wish I would see like more of that aspect. Me too. Or learning Me too.

Tanisha 49:07

Yeah,, that's my little nickname, I'm the joyful leader because I feel like why would I wanna be in a classroom or a school every day if I'm not enjoying it?

Kelsey 49:14

Mm-hmm.

Amanda 49:16

Yeah.

Tanisha 49:16

Yeah. Yeah.

Amanda 49:18

It makes me think thinking about joy and also getting students excited about reading and writing and providing access to them in a way that might be a bit more non-traditional. And you were mentioning like oral traditions and storytelling, and this was many years ago.'Cause my background's in theater, we would go into local public schools and would teach students from grades, I think it was three to eight, how to write creatively using theater and music and dance. And it was incredible because the students could see in real time how to craft a story. Put their ideas out there, see all the different elements, and we would act things out. We would improvise. We'd use dance and music to bring their stories to life in real time. And it did very much, to your point, Kelsey encapsulate that joy of creating and that joy of sharing. It was also very communal activity as well. And then they were able to take those skills and transfer them to getting pen to paper. And I think it is things like that that are really going to help promote literacy in a way that is again, accessible and sustainable in our schools versus the way that we're currently teaching it.'cause it, yeah, there's such a huge barrier there.

Tanisha 50:30

Yeah. I love that. That's arts integration. Yeah. That's a good

Amanda 50:34

it's why it's literally the reason why I went to grad school because my thesis was on how to. Increase critical literacy in students using theater as that tool, because I was like, I wanna explore this more. There is something here. And if we could tap into this, I think we'd really have, yeah. So many more joyful, skilled readers.

Tanisha 50:55

I agree 100%. Yeah.

Amanda 50:57

Yeah. Do you think, that's obviously one way to get students excited about, reading and writing. Do you think there are other ways that teachers, families, communities can help their students when they are feeling reluctant or discouraged as a reader?

Tanisha 51:16

I think knowing who our students are is really important because if we know who they are, we can start tapping into their interest.

Kelsey 51:22

Mm-hmm. And

Tanisha 51:23

find to really like appeal. Like I remember when I was teaching sixth grade and I had a group of students who just super reluctant, to really get engaged. In this case they were boys but they were athletes. They were all athletes and they really like, were like, reading is so boring, I don't wanna read blah, blah, blah. And and now I forgot the name of this author, but he only specialized like in sports based ya. And so he did like football, he did softball, he did track like. All, baseball, like all of his books were based around a sport. Mm-hmm. And he was captivating. And I remember starting a little book club Hey, why don't y'all just try it? I'll read it with you. And it changed, like it, all of a sudden I couldn't keep those books on my shelf. Like they wanted the next book, like right away. And that was like a situation where I don't think it's unique, because I also seen that happen, like with, with authors like Jason Reynolds, you find the right book for the right youth at the right time and they can be captivated.

Kelsey 52:13

Mm-hmm.

Tanisha 52:13

But I think it means like slowing down, I think like really engaging in the art of read alouds. Like I think we are never too old to have a really strong read aloud and really have deep conversation around a theme or a character in a book.

Kelsey 52:25

Yeah.

Tanisha 52:25

I'd love to see more of that. I also I personally subscribe this year for, for the team I support in in the district I'm working in right now, there's something that Kwame Alexander is doing called One World. Mm-hmm. And it's every month he has an author that he showcases he brings in an author and they talk about the new book that this author has written or whatever book this author's written. And he does it geared towards students. So students are the audience and he is talking about, Hey, here's a pattern of what we're noticing. And and he'll like model after a piece of his book. So He'll read a little chunk of that and say, what do you notice about what I'm reading? You give it a try, let's do some practice. Like right now it's like a half hour, 45 minute interactive, like half writing workshop. Mm-hmm. Half, author book talk. That seems like a really cool way to engage youth as well.

Kelsey 53:10

Mm-hmm.

Tanisha 53:11

And I think also just like that piece Kelsey's talking about, the pushing and the pressure, like what are we pressuring for? So if we could alleviate some of the pressure around production

Kelsey 53:20

mm-hmm.

Tanisha 53:20

And really think about hey, I had the conversation with my husband the day he's also a writer. And we were talking about if you can write a really strong paragraph, like a really strong paragraph, I don't need you to prove to me you can write five paragraphs. Mm-hmm. Let's focus on the really strong paragraph right now and celebrate that. Mm-hmm. And, and look at how that makes you feel and what are the beautiful parts of that really strong paragraph. And then let me let you figure out what the next step is gonna be like. I'm gonna grow with you. And some of it is not meant for the time that we have. This what the structure of the day, the time of the class, like all those kind of logistical things that I know are real. But if we could like. I dunno, push against some of that a little, or, soften some of those edges. For students who are struggling, they're struggling because the way it's set up is not working. So why can't we evaluate how things are set up and figure out another way? I don't see that lightly. I know it takes time and energy, but I don't care. I'm willing to like, give a little bit of that energy if it's gonna make, a stronger production outcome on the other end.

Amanda 54:17

Absolutely. Yeah. Absolutely. And I think too, when you were talking at the beginning of that response about finding those books for that particular group of boys mm-hmm. That really enjoyed. Sports and being an athlete. I think the other piece to all of this is having really great librarians, because that is a huge part of being a great, especially school librarian, is like knowing who a child is as a student, as a reader, knowing what their interests are and pairing them with that perfect book that's really gonna open that up to them. I had the privilege of working with a great librarian at my previous school and we're still really great friends and she was so good at really getting to know the students deeply and then finding that niche for them that she knew would just unlock that joy and love for reading. So that's such an important piece to all of this. Yeah. Love our librarians.

Kelsey 55:07

And maybe you were saying just last night, you, your school doesn't have a library?

Amanda 55:12

Our school does not have a library and it is, it breaks my heart. There's been a lot of, kind of conversation and controversy around it. Because a library is more than just a collection of books. Yeah. And I think sometimes, different folks in leadership positions don't always recognize. Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm. And yeah it's something that a lot of us educators at my school have really struggled with and have pushed back against to no avail, but Yeah. Yeah. Really distressing. Yeah.

Kelsey 55:42

Thinking about that educator piece I'm curious Tanisha, like thinking about your work with students mm-hmm. What have your students taught you about storytelling and imagination?

Tanisha 55:55

Yeah. This is good. Like I said, some of the strongest pieces of exploring stories have come from my students like, and I don't teach in a classroom anymore, so now I'm like a person that, helps support other people that do teach in classes. And so the access that I get to have to students is really when I go in and ask how are things going? Which what are you reading? And things like that. What they tell me or what I'm learning and continue to learn is that storytelling is never gonna go outta style. Mm-hmm. People want to have stories. Yeah. And there's something about, I think the beautiful way in which you connect with each other through storytelling that breaks down barriers. Mm-hmm. And so if I know your story, if I know a story that you like that maybe I also will like, we have a better chance of figuring out what we have in common than what we don't have in common. Mm-hmm. And I feel like a lot of youth are reading right now, people will say, youth are never reading. I think a lot of youth are actually reading right now.

Kelsey 56:44

Yeah.

Tanisha 56:44

And so they're getting stories from somewhere and they're talking about stories somewhere. And wow. I wish those kind of like conversations could be more open to all of us too. But I think we got to do the work as adults and like lean and listen. Mm-hmm. And pay attention. So I'm learning that storytelling is happening. I'm also learning that they have them, they have the imagination. Like they're the ones that are still imagining and creating. I think they're like, what are you all doing over there? What? What's happening? But it's also that imagination and creativity that is gonna change our, like we are depending on them. We need them right now. Mm-hmm. And they're showing up, like they are showing up. But that's what's gonna change our world. That's what's gonna change the way we're doing things. So every good story has a lesson. I believe this, I know this to be true. Every good story has a really strong character we learn from. Mm-hmm. And I think that that the stories that, that our youth are reading, the stories that are being written for our youth right now are providing them with some really strong models and examples of how they can change the world.

Amanda 57:38

Yeah. Beautifully said. And could not agree more. So in starting to wrap things up, I think one final question we had was, when you are looking to the future, right? What are some of the literacy or community projects that you're dreaming about or hoping for right now?

Tanisha 57:59

Yeah. So what I am hoping for, like for me personally or just like in general, either whichever. Okay. Generally I like to see us really shift into just making more transparent the stories that we are talking about and creating spaces where we have some cross-generational opportunity to talk about the stories. I think that there's power in that conversation for our youth and also for the older people in our community. God, I wish we could change the way we talk about literacy to reaffirm and not be so negative around what we don't have and talk more about what we do have. Mm-hmm. And opportunities that we can move forward in. And continuing to publish books by authors of color in across identities. Like just keep doing that. We're never gonna have enough. So like this point in supporting really strong authors of color and across all identities I think is really important. That's what I'd love to see generally. Yeah, I just wanna see that shift in our world and continue build being built in our world. Yes. Yeah. Snaps to that

Amanda 58:56

absolutely cannot get enough. And it's why we do our Litre episodes every month because we do want our listeners to be engaging with authors from different backgrounds and identities. And again, providing them with those Windows Insights, perspectives. Yeah. To connect with others and to develop empathy and understanding. It's so important and stories have the power to do that. Absolutely.

Kelsey 59:20

Before we get into this last section, Tanisha, I just wanna help clarify, you never read Children of Blood and Bone? I have not. No. I had thought you would have. Okay. I know. And

Tanisha 59:31

people keep, or people are so surprised I haven't, I will, but I'll at some point. I just haven't, I haven't, I have a, I have a stack, like this big Yeah.

Amanda 59:41

Or never ending TV artist adding to

Tanisha 59:43

it.

Kelsey 59:44

Like this whole thing back here. You can't see it all. All of this is my life stack. This whole,

Tanisha 59:49

oh my goodness.

Lit It or Quit It: Rapid Fire

Kelsey 59:52

It just keeps growing and growing yeah. Yeah. Okay. Just wanna double check. So what we do here is we say the title and then you let us know whether or not they were a litted, which is, it was really wonderful and great, and you would recommend it or ac quit it, something you didn't really like.

Tanisha 1:00:11

Okay. Do I just answer lit it or quit it? That's it.

Kelsey 1:00:14

Yeah, we can talk about, yeah. So super rapid fire. Okay. Okay. We can talk about it too though. It's

Tanisha 1:00:21

okay. First one, Verity by Colleen Hoover. It won't be popular, but I'm gonna say quit it. It's not my favorite color. Devastated.

Amanda 1:00:31

Absolutely devastated. I

Tanisha 1:00:33

That's okay. That is okay. It's not Okay. Other things that she writes. So I think I'm more into her romcom stuff, but that's just me.

Amanda 1:00:42

Okay. That's okay.

Tanisha 1:00:42

That movie is coming out this year

Kelsey 1:00:43

too.

Tanisha 1:00:44

I, which I'm probably gonna go see

Amanda 1:00:46

it should be good. The book. I loved the book'cause it's so twisty and bonkers. It's so

Tanisha 1:00:49

twisty. I was like, oh my, so maybe that's part of it too Creepy.

Amanda 1:00:53

Yeah, it is also slightly creepy. Yeah. All right. Next one. Twilight by Stephanie Myers.

Tanisha 1:00:59

Love it. Oh my God. I know, right? Like I know quality, I don't know, but the story. Yes. I'm all in.

Amanda 1:01:07

I can see why you and Kelsey are friends. This is all just becoming so clear now.

Kelsey 1:01:14

Oh, okay. Before I let go by

Tanisha 1:01:16

Kennedy Ryan. Oh my goodness. Yes. Lit it, that and the other two that go with it. Yes, absolutely.

Kelsey 1:01:22

I haven't read the other two yet, but we did. Oh, good. The episode together. Yeah. And

Amanda 1:01:26

I did it up. Liking that one for the most part. I think I gave it a soft lit it. Yeah.

Tanisha 1:01:29

Yeah.

Amanda 1:01:30

Okay. Let's see. Sunrise on the Reaping by Suzanne Collins.

Tanisha 1:01:34

Lit it like,

Amanda 1:01:34

okay. Yes.

Tanisha 1:01:36

Oh my goodness. Yes. Yes. She's such a great storyteller. I wasn't sure can we continue? Yeah, I guess we can continue.

Kelsey 1:01:42

It's the same thing, but Yes.

Amanda 1:01:43

But we're here for it. And the movie is also gonna be phenomenal. I

Kelsey 1:01:47

cannot wait. Yeah. Oh,

Amanda 1:01:49

so good.

Kelsey 1:01:51

What is it? November? We have to wait.

Amanda 1:01:52

November. Yeah.

Kelsey 1:01:54

Yeah. Okay. And then the final one, which actually we haven't done an episode on this one, but we talk about it so much on the podcast. I have to include it. All My Rage by Saba to hear Absolutely lit it. Yes. Yay. I would be mad if it.

Amanda 1:02:19

It is so good. Yeah. Kelsey kept raving it. It's funny because I am the one who originally recommended this book, not past, this, past not 20 25, 20 24, but I hadn't read it yet. But I was like, it looks great. Kelsey then read it and was like, obsessed that I read it and was also equally obsessed. It's, she's such a phenomenal writer and gut wrenching, such a gut wrenching book. Yeah.

Kelsey 1:02:41

That's her air book here. Oh. That I'm gonna be reading, oh,

Amanda 1:02:46

yeah. That's a beautiful

Kelsey 1:02:47

cover too. Okay. But she writes fantasy as well, so ya fantasy. So that's what this one is.

Closing Remarks and Social Media Plugs

Amanda 1:02:55

It's gonna be amazing. So before we close today, we wanted to quickly Tanisha give you the opportunity to plug your channel and summarize really quickly for folks, what they can expect Yeah. On your book Tube Channel and then anything else you'd like our listeners to know.

Tanisha 1:03:12

Okay. So I gotta show off the shirt that my daughter Yes.

Amanda 1:03:15

We love.

Tanisha 1:03:17

Yes. Yes. Yeah, so talking books with Tanisha on YouTube, it is something that started off as like a live feed for Facebook during the COVID like pandemic because I was like. I'm feeling isolated. What if we talk about books? Who wants to join me? And then I just really started thinking about like the books that I'm reading and how I wanted to share those stories. And also like putting a book into the hands of someone can like open doors. And so like the feel and sentiment behind talking books with Tanisha is either talking to people about books, in some cases, talking to authors about their books or just me talking to, everyone about the books that I'm reading. They're by season, so there's like seven seasons right now, the seventh season right now. Mm-hmm. And I also have like holiday specials and summer book dumps and all that. But just really a way to advertise some of the stories that I really have loved and just want other people to love too. So that's what that really love that. Yeah.

Amanda 1:04:07

And do you also

Tanisha 1:04:08

have

Amanda 1:04:08

socials where folks can follow you or is it just the book

Tanisha 1:04:10

Tube channel? Yeah, no, I have Instagram, so talking books with Tanisha on Instagram is my handle for that. And then you can find me on those two? Yeah, those two platforms. YouTube and Instagram. Fantastic. Thank you.

Kelsey 1:04:21

Often do you come out with a new episode?

Tanisha 1:04:25

Yeah, so right now I'm on my little winter hiatus. I had my last one right at the beginning of December is when I did my season one. But usually it comes out every Sunday automatically. And right now, the next half of the season seven will launch again, like probably in the beginning of February. Okay. Yeah.

Amanda 1:04:40

Excellent. Okay, so it'll be at the beginning of this month that this episode is dropping. You can on all

Tanisha 1:04:44

the rest of the videos, there's so many videos there you can look at right now.

Amanda 1:04:48

Fantastic. Thank you so much.

Kelsey 1:04:51

before we go to make sure you have to know where

Tanisha 1:04:53

can we find your books? Oh, okay. So it's been a second, but they're available on Amazon, so that's where you can find them.

Amanda 1:04:59

Perfect.

Kelsey 1:05:00

Yeah, we'll be sure to link those in our show note.

Amanda 1:05:04

Yes, so you can click those links and purchase Tanisha's books. We really appreciate you taking the time out of your busy weekend to chat with us and share more about what you're doing in terms of literacy and education and writing and reading. Just so much good stuff. And thank you to our listeners for tuning in. As a reminder, you can find us on our socials on Instagram at Lit Vibes only under podcast. You can watch this episode on YouTube at Lit Vibes only podcast and you can come hang out with us on TikTok, also at Lit Vibes Only podcast. So if you haven't already, like follow, comment, subscribe, all of that good stuff. And also as a reminder, if you have not yet done so, don't forget to rate and review. You can do that as soon as you hear the Outra music for this episode. Hit that five star button. Leave us a comment or review depending on which platform you're on. And if you have not yet followed us on Fable, you can find me at Lit Vibes only dash, Amanda Kelsey at Lit Vibes only dash Kelsey, and really dive into these books and episodes more deeply with us, even beyond our socials. It's a great way to connect with you. We'd love to see you in our upcoming book clubs, and we'd love to hear what your thoughts are for our next reads on those episodes. So thank you so much for joining us, Tanisha. Thank you guys so much for hanging out with us, and we'll see you next Monday.