Lit Vibes Only
Kelsey and Amanda are two book besties who love to "Lit the Sh*t" out of books they love and hate! In their Lit it or Quit It episodes, Kelsey and Amanda are forced to read the other's favorite books. While Amanda loves to read historical fiction and mystery/thrillers, you'll find Kelsey curled up with just about any romantasy. They discuss the books at length and, in the end, decide whether the book is a "Lit It" or "Quit It"! Every month they'll also give some book recs you just can't miss. Look out for the bonus episodes about bookish topics and books that were adapted into movies/shows.
Listen in and choose whose side you're on, or perhaps find yourself intrigued by a book you wouldn't normally go for. See you on Mondays!
Lit Vibes Only
Ep. 54: Lit It or Quit It: Gideon the Ninth by Tamsyn Muir
Join Kelsey and Amanda as they navigate the gothic space adventure of 'Gideon the Ninth,' with its irreverent humor, complicated necromancy, and an overabundance of descriptive gloom. They explore the tumultuous romance and intricate puzzles that have divided fans and left them both entertained and perplexed.
00:00 Welcome to Lit Vibes Only!
00:42 Follow Us On Social Media
03:45 Current Reads and Book Recommendations
11:54 Summary of Gideon the Ninth
19:37 Book Discussion
50:05 Final Thoughts and Recommendations
51:27 LITerally the Best or LITerally the Worst
Follow us on TikTok & Youtube @litvibesonlypodcast and on Instagram @litvibesonly_podcast. You can also email us at litvibesonlypodcast@gmail.com We'd love to hear from you!
See you on Mondays!
Kelsey 2.0: [00:00:00] Welcome to Lit Vibes Only, where we lit the shit outta books we love and hate. I'm Kelsey, the unhinged, diehard, romantic and fantasy reader. And I'm
Amanda: Amanda, the insightful, thrill seeker and historical fiction nerd. Welcome back. Hey, hey, hey. We're so excited you're here on another gorgeous Monday. Well, actually, I don't know what the weather is today, wherever you are, but
Kelsey: it's
Amanda: gorgeous
Kelsey: over here on a Sunday.
Amanda: Yes. And granted, it is still August and summertime, fully summertime here in Seattle, so it's a gorgeous day. But welcome. We're so glad you're here. As always, if you have not taken a moment to follow us on socials. Take a moment and do that. We are on. What the heck have you been doing?
What have you been doing with your lives? We're on Instagram at Lit Vibes only podcast, and we're also on YouTube and TikTok at Lit Vibes only [00:01:00] podcast. Mm-hmm. So like, follow, comment, subscribe, all of the things if you're not currently doing them. And if you like to watch your podcast versus listening to them, you can watch the full length video episodes on our YouTube channel.
So lots of good ways to connect with us to get extra content beyond what we do here on the podcast. Lots of fun content. See are beautiful faces. See our beautiful faces. And if social media is not your jam, you can also reach out to us via email at lit True Vibes only podcast@gmail.com. And actually.
They just reminded me, Kelsey and I, we got a I don't know how to say it. Like a a, an arc offer. Like an advanced reader. Copy. Yeah. Offer from like a legit publisher, like a legit book that's coming up. This is so cool. In September. So, that's really exciting. Hopefully it all works out. I sent them our info to get Yeah.
Physical copies of the book, but if that happens, we'll definitely be putting out some [00:02:00] content for that, so. Mm-hmm. We're sure you wanna follow us on socials. What was the, what was this one about? It is about a woman in her thirties who's just like, doing life and I believe her, oh God, I wanna say us.
It's like her. Is it the women in her life or her ancestors? Something who are like basically, oh, helping her like get herself sorted. I don't wanna say too much one, 'cause I don't know if we're actually gonna get the book and two, because it'd be cool. I didn't, I didn't read through it that thoroughly.
When I got the email I was just like, fair, fair. Oh my God. They compared her to Elizabeth Acevedo, who I love. She's the author of the Poet X and Clap When You Land. Yeah. Both books, which I've mentioned on this podcast. Yeah. So I was like, if she is like Elizabeth Acevedo, I'm gonna love this book.
Great.
Kelsey: Cool. So we'll
Amanda: keep you posted.
Kelsey: There was another one in our not dms, but our, our email, Gmail. And I said, death. What did I tell you? It's said Betsy has Beth, Beth is killed someone. Beth is dead. Beth is dead. Beth is dead. And it's based on little [00:03:00] women. But instead of Beth living, she dies. At the beginning and then it's like this murder mystery thing. Oh. And I felt like he was like, it, I look like it. Love little women love murder mysteries. Like yeah. I was like historical fiction, like, yeah. Yes. This is Amanda's jam.
Amanda: That is my jam. I must have missed that email 'cause I definitely didn't see it.
When was
Kelsey: it sent? Before the one that you told me about. Okay. So it's just down the way a little bit. Okay. I went in and I deleted a bunch of emails 'cause it Oh we have a bunch really bothering me.
Amanda: Did you
Kelsey: respond to this Beth Is Dad person? I didn't because that's totally all you. I have no interest in that book.
Amanda: Alright, I'll put it on my to-do list because I want to read this book. It sounds fascinating. . But speaking of books, what are you currently reading?
Kelsey: Oh my god. The only thing I've had time for, I already know what this, Katie. The Ninth. Oh, pleasant. Okay. So yesterday I almost messaged you, but I had still eight [00:04:00] hours of listening to do when I woke up.
Yesterday morning. Oh my God. Yes. That's,
Amanda: I was gonna ask if you listened to it or read it because, well,
Kelsey: I bought it and I started reading it. Yeah. And I was like, what the fuck? There's no way I'm getting through this book without listening to it. Yes.
Amanda: I feel like that would be so hard because there's so many characters in houses to keep track of.
Like, I don't know. How you would've done that? Just listening. I would've been so confused. We'll talk about it
Kelsey: more.
Amanda: Yes. We'll,
Okay. Well I am actually also listening to an audiobook. I'm like taking my sweet time through this one, but it is somewhere beyond the C by TJ Kone which is the sequel to the House.
And the Ian Sea and Kelsey listened to the audiobook for both. Mm-hmm. And told me that they were quite delightful and that the Yes narrator does all the different voices for the characters mm-hmm. And the children. And it is just that It is delightful. Its so cute. They're really enjoying it. And the kids are hilarious.
Like, I love the children. I wanna [00:05:00] go to Marcia's Island and just hang out with them for like a week. But that's been amazing. And obviously as I'm listening to an audio book, I'm also reading as well, like a physical book. Yeah. And I just finished Blood Over BrightHaven by Emma. I think it's Emma Wong.
And Oh my God, oh my God. Like. It. Ugh. Like Chef's Kiss five stars. It, I, and also it's a standalone fantasy book. I like it. Which, which is a rarity. I think you would like it because. The book is brimming, like absolutely brimming with political and social commentary. Oh,
Kelsey: okay. In a way
Amanda: that is really insightful and unique and compelling, but also has very clear ties to our world and what's happening and what has happened.
Ooh. And she's just really smart about it. Yeah. It touches on colonization and sexism, like just [00:06:00] all of these things, but in a way that doesn't feel trite or cliched or like too on the nose, Uhhuh. It. It's great. I don't know. I'm gonna be recommending, this is one of those books I'm gonna like Ooh, continually be recommending fun.
We might have to do it for the podcast. Podcast. I will for sure be recommending it for my book club because there's just so much there to dive into and discuss. Cool.
Kelsey: So yeah, that's what I've been getting into it. I think I have it on my TBR, but I just haven't like known when to read it. Yeah. Or if I would like it.
Amanda: Yeah, it's, I mean, granted it's a heavy book, so it's definitely one of those books, it's, it's not a TJ Clune where it's like, oh, this is so numb. That heartwarming. It's not a cozy read, but it. Yeah. It really makes you think it. Yeah. Yeah. I'll, that's all I'll say. That is all I'll say because I don't wanna like get into a whole thing fun.
But yeah. I don't even know what I'm gonna read next. I'm gonna have to figure that out. You're gonna have to do something fun and light after getting in the night. I feel like something just feel good and like [00:07:00] easy to breeze through. Yeah. I'm gonna be reading Kelsey's book for me I guess Oh yeah.
Or next month, which is Emily, my first Emily Henry
Kelsey: novel. So I Do you think you'll like aspects of this book? For sure. I don't know that it'll be like a lit overall for you, but I think you'll like aspects of the book.
Amanda: All right. Well, we
Kelsey: shall see. We'll have to tune in for that episode. There's like a slight mystery and there's like historical fiction in there.
It's, yes, it crosses
Amanda: Okay.
Kelsey: Genre.
Amanda: Yeah. Touches on a bunch of different genres. Well, we have a fabulous book to. Dive into today. One that Kelsey was like, fabulous is subjective, overjoyed to read. She kept on saying, Amanda, when am I gonna read this? Like, when are you gonna have me read this? I can't wait to read it.
I'm excited. Yeah. That was were
Kelsey: my exact words, Amanda. It was more like, oh, I don't wanna read that. Look at the cover. I was like, I think the
Amanda: cover's great. I still don't understand why you don't, don't like it. Hate the, I don't, I
Kelsey: hate the cover.
Amanda: Can you, okay, before we get into this, because this was your number one [00:08:00] complaint before reading the book, what is it specifically about the cover that you don't like?
It just looks awful. That's not, give me some criteria. It's what
Kelsey: makes it ugly dark. Because it's, why do they have face paint on and like what, what, like what is that about? I just noticed the sunglasses. I know it comes up in the book, but like, I just noticed them for. Oh my God. This was it. I thought it was a skeleton this whole time instead of sunglasses.
Well, I mean, it kind of is like the rest of her faces. She's not a real skeleton. No, but like, this is what I always thought. I I did not realize, I dunno if they were sunglasses, actually. Sunglasses. Yeah. Well it mentions it in the book. Yeah, it's
Amanda: true. Oh
Kelsey: my
Amanda: God. So for those of you who are watching on, it's just like
Kelsey: blood spewing everywhere.
Like it's gross looking.
Amanda: It is a bit violent and dark I suppose. But for those of you who, who are not watching on YouTube and you can't see it, it's essentially a figure of a woman facing you. Yeah. Head on. And she has kind of [00:09:00] a skeleton mask that's been painted on her face.
She's wearing all black 'cause her shock of red hair and is apparently wearing black because sunglasses, I think it's kind of slick and cool. And it has short and ginger hair. Yeah. Short red hair. That puts up in the book too. But I personally feel like it is a accurate representation of the book.
I think it's definitely one of those covers. It's like, oh. It very much gives you a sense of what the book's gonna be about and like the tone and vibe Yes. Of the book. But anyhow, tell us, Amanda, why did you have me read this book? I had Kelsey read this book, one, because I thought it would be fun to again flip the script a little bit and have Kelsey read a fantasy book that I was recommending, because fantasy tends to be Kelsey's wheelhouse.
Mm-hmm. This book was recommended to me by a colleague of mine. At my school who she loves this book, it is like one of her top reads. She recommends it to everyone. And even though I don't read a lot of fantasy and certainly didn't know a whole lot about Kerman, she sold it really well. [00:10:00] And I did end up in spite of my initial hesitations with this book, enjoying it.
I would like to just preface all of this by saying, this is not a, like I am obsessed with this book. Five out of five. Everyone should read it like that. I not like I saw you. Good reads. Yeah. I'm not obsessed with this book by any means to that degree, but I enjoyed it and I thought that if I was gonna have Kelsey read a fantasy, because it is kind of bizarre, it would make for a really fun episode and I figured she would have a pretty interesting reaction to it.
That would lead to a really good conversation. So really those were my main my main reasons. And also kind of similar with Red Rising, like the fan base for Gideon the ninth, like if you love the Gideon the ninth and like the locked to series, like you're super into it and you're super into Tams and Muir.
So yeah, those were my reasons. Okay. So Kelsey, I, I already know the answer, but I don't think you
Kelsey: do. Short answer. Was this book a [00:11:00] lit it or quit it for you? I went back and forth on this one because it's like, yeah, I did. And so I, I was like, okay. Trying to weigh the pros and cons of how much I liked and disliked this book.
It's gonna get a soft Quit it.
Amanda: Oh, okay. I'll take that. I thought for sure was gonna be like, hated this book with every fiber of my being. No, I'll take that. Alright. It, yes, that's actually, I, I'm surprised it didn't
Kelsey: deserve to soft lit it, but it didn't deserve a full on quit it. Okay.
Amanda: Yeah, I am, I'm actually quite ecstatic to hear that and I was not expecting to hear that either.
Especially from the text I was getting from you. I was like, oh yes, she is gonna hate this. We talk video you made.
Kelsey: Oh yeah. That was real though. Oh, I know. Oh my God. Okay. Can we get into it? Yeah, get into it. I get into the
Amanda: summary that I liked. Oh yeah. Well, you get into summary. Need to do the summary.
You're like, forget the summary.
Kelsey: Here we go. People. Buckle up because this is a long one. Yeah. All right. Okay. [00:12:00] I'm just gonna get into it. It's like I have so much commentary. It's been so hard to not say anything. Okay. Just the summary and then we'll get to the commentary. Okay. All right. It starts with the prologue.
Introduces Gideon nav in the ninth house. She's plotting yet another escape with her sword and porn magazine's classic Gideon humor hero. The other main character catches her stopping the attempt and their longstanding rivalry is established. The emperor summons, heirs and cavaliers from each house to the first house.
Harrow needs Gideon as her Cavalier. So Gideon trains their toxic relationship is on full display. Har bargains with Gideon. If Gideon serves as her cavalier, she'll grant her freedom afterwards.
Gideon begrudgingly agrees and they depart the first house with other house representatives. Now the other thing that's important to [00:13:00] know is Harrow, is what's called a necromancer.
And she essentially can create skeletons and control them. Okay. That is my understanding is what I've read so far or what I read. They arrive at the first house. The first house is a vast decaying palace filled with locked doors and strange relics, creepy and haunted atmosphere.
All houses introduced key players include the loyal seconds, smug thirds, the tragic fifths, brilliant. Sixth religious. Seventh and deadly eighths. Emperor servants announced the trial. Each heir must attempt to unlock the secrets of lter hood. No clear rules given suspicion immediately spreads.
Each necromancer and Cavalier pair explores different sections of the house, countering puzzles, locked laboratories, and [00:14:00] bone based experiments. Gideon and Harrow reluctantly cooperate. Gide proves her combat skills. Harold demonstrates ne romantic brilliance and first death occurs at panic arising.
And the trials aren't just puzzles. Something sinister is stalking them too., House pairs form uneasy alliances, but mistrust grows Gideon bonds with some Cavaliers especially.
Of the seventh Harrow pushes Gideon's limits with exhausting tests. Their hostility starts shifting toward teamwork and more deaths. The true danger of the trials become evident. And it is not just the locked labs, but betrayal and murder among houses.
Gideon investigates relationships across houses fracture third house and eighth house are especially hostile. Gideon and Harrow have breakthrough moments of [00:15:00] trust, and Gideon realizes Harold's brilliance hides loneliness and pressure as the ninth heir LTER hood requires necromancers and cavalier to merge with a cavalier soul consumed.
This raises the stakes dramatically and, i'll get to a couple other things after I go through this, but the final confrontations in part six is other houses attempt to kill Harrow and Gideon leading to brutal dues and betrayals. And they discover the emperor's cruel test is immortality demands ultimate sacrifice.
And Gideon realizing Harrow cannot survive without her, chooses self sacrifice and Gideon dies offering herself so Harrow can live and ascend and Harrow becomes a ter in the end. In the epilogue. Harrow Awakens as a ter traumatized by Gideon's death. The Emperor's Grand Plan [00:16:00] continues, but Harrow.
Carries Gideon inside her, literally and emotionally. And this sets up the sequel Harold the Ninth with questions about memory, grief, and identity. So I guess the thing that I will say this summary, doesn't get into the intricacies of let's say for example, AYA like one of the main characters who Gideon really forms a bond and relationship with.
And it turns out that, and I couldn't have gotten to all of these details, but this is just one that was interesting to me. Turns out that Dolce is a character who is deathly ill and basically on her deathbed, like she's going to die imminently, right? Very soon. And it turns out someone switched her.
Place on the ship coming to the first house. And it was someone who was already a [00:17:00] lecter and the real dolce was hidden from people, but then doe's Cavalier dies. And so for some reason, which I don't understand, the person who is taking doe's place had to kill Doe
so basically she burned, doe's body like, burned her to death and yeah, it is wild. So that's just like one thing. But yes, I,
Amanda (2): yeah. I also wanna , add and clarify a couple of things for folks. Sure. So one, ultimately hero and Gideon, in spite of their rough beginnings, do end up. Falling in love with each other so there is this lesbian romance at the center of the story and it's kind of cool to see that arc. I would also say just a bit of clarity about this world. So these nine houses, they all practice different forms of necromancy, uhhuh.
And each heir to each house again, is invited to the first house Canaan house. It has , [00:18:00] this big dec canan castle like Kelsey mentioned. And each heir has the Cavalier is like their knight. It's like their protector, their fighter for them. Yes. And also they can be siphoned.
So an heir can basically suck the life force out of their cavalier in order to enhance their own powers, et cetera. And that factors in multiple times in the story.
And that is actually a kind of important part of the plot as well. So like I wanted to clarify those things and yeah, it's just like this kind of solar system of different houses slash planets, right? Where people are coming from. Mm-hmm. Just to give people a bit of context as to how this world works and so they're all coming to compete because if you're a lecter you ultimately get to serve the emperor who is like this kind of, I don't even know, omni shit.
God omni the present godlike individual figure force that kind of rules this world. And it's a great honor to be a lecter and have that position. So that's why they're all kind of clamoring for [00:19:00] it. So yeah, just wanted to . Clarify that a little bit for folks as well. Mm-hmm. But there are so many characters in this book and so many houses that it is very difficult to track.
And I remember I had issues with that when I started reading this book. Yes. But thank you Kelsey and Chad, GBT for helping us with that summary. Why don't we as always start with the positives and I guess there must be some, 'cause this was a soft wit, so let's hear
Kelsey: them. It's so funny 'cause sometimes I feel like I end up convincing myself.
I'm like, actually I really didn't like this book. Or actually I did like this book through our conversations.
Amanda: Mm-hmm.
Kelsey: But okay. So one of the things that I really did like was the humor in it. Yes. And it was totally dark humor. It was hilarious to me because they were just like really outlandish comments made throughout the book.
That were really funny and would just be like, oh my God. Okay. And I have a few. Yay. [00:20:00] Love it. So these are all, I think these are all Gideon's quotes. This one, no context. Whoops, my bad for a moment. I thought you weren't a huge bitch. Talking to Harrow. Harrow. And it's just like stupid comments as well.
This was, this is a Gideon quote for one of the moments that Harrow was sucking the life force out of her.
Amanda: Mm-hmm.
Kelsey: Said it would've been peaceful, only it sucked. And I'm just like, okay. Like it just pulls you out and is like, what the fuck? I don't remember what this was about, but the line was colder than 10, which is tits.
What is that even referred? That's so descriptive, but like why witches? Why are witches cold? Why are their tits cold? I
Amanda: have, I actually have heard phrases that involve being cold as a witch is whatever. Like, I think that expression has been around for quite [00:21:00] some time.
Okay. So I think it's just like a, a spin on that. Yeah. I, I couldn't tell you why though.
Kelsey: Okay. I have one last one. And again, this is just Gideon talking to Harrow. Mm-hmm. Harrow rarely had like these kind of comments. It was mostly Gideon. Oh. It's mostly Gideon Gideon's. So irreverent and it's great. If my heart had a dick, you would kick it.
Amanda: I think that's my favorite. Out of all the ones you just said, what, like what? I mean it makes perfect sense. I get exactly what she's trying to communicate, like, love her use of language. So
Kelsey: I did have fun with those moments. So, I have to think about what else I liked because there was a lot I didn't like. Okay. I don't know. I think I, it's not the world building necessarily, but it was one of my first, like, it was almost a dark romance where it's a really dark book, right?
Mm-hmm. And the themes throughout, it wasn't just about people dying or it being gruesome. The whole like [00:22:00] air of, the entire novel is dark. Yeah. One of the things I didn't like was how descriptive of the dark it was. Like, this is what made it so confusing. Okay. Was because it it, it just like overly described things in the book that I just didn't think were necessary because maybe in the beginning it would've been good to have those descriptions.
Mm-hmm. But it just continues and continues and continues. So you feel like
Amanda: the book is overly descriptive when it doesn't need to be? Yeah.
Kelsey: So this is description of the ninth house's gloom. The atrium was a dead cathedral of a dead religion. All Blackstone and bone dust filled with the memory of prayers that had never been answered. Creepy church. Right.
Like that's all it was describing. Yeah. Is a creepy church.
Amanda: I think it's, I think it's a great description,
Kelsey: but [00:23:00] this happens every few sentences. Like it's so, it's too much. And I hated it. I hated it. Okay. And I think this is why people think it's so confusing because it's just always like roundabout everything.
And even for the word world building, you don't really understand. You don't get an understanding of the world because it doesn't tell you, it's like all this is it showing you versus telling you. But there needs to be a good mixture of those things. Mm-hmm. And she very much leaned on only showing I see.
Ever. And that just really bothered me. And then I have one other example of how this happens. This description of a person let the king undying ransomer of death, scourge of death, vindicator of death. Like why do you have four of these descriptors of the same thing?
Like it's just that. Type of writing mm-hmm. Really annoys me. I see. [00:24:00] And also, I didn't highlight this, I just went to a random page and was like, yep, there it is. Like, that's just one example of the kind of writing that is in this book.
Amanda: Mm-hmm.
Kelsey: It really, really bothered me.
Amanda: Yeah. I, it's interesting, my experience with this book is that I can see your point to a certain degree. I do remember when I read this book, which was a while ago. Yeah. I, it took me a significant period of time to get into this book and enjoy it. Uhhuh. I kind of liked Gideon from the start. I liked her tone her, or sorry, I liked her voice.
I liked her humor and like I said, her reverence. And so I enjoyed. Being in her head from the start, but everything else, it took me a minute to get into. With that said, I do think that the atmosphere and the setting of this book is really important and I think it's why Tamsin spends so much time, as you were saying, like on descriptions of what a place might look like or perhaps a [00:25:00] particular individual even.
Because I think she is trying to, I think that's her way of building her world, right? Yes. And authors can do that in a variety of ways until like, this is her way of doing that. Yeah. And I felt like, , for me personally, the feeling of gloom and decay and death was so visceral because of her descriptions that even though I'm not a fan of any of those things it made sense for a book about riman and I felt very much like.
Inserted into that. I don't know, feeling that space, that setting. So like mm-hmm. I liked it. I can see it being a bit like, okay, you're beating us over the head with this. But yes, I, again, I think as someone who personally can be a bit superfluous when I'm writing and perhaps overly descriptive, I didn't
Kelsey: mind it.
I think as much as you did. Yeah. And I think some people really love that. Yeah. But it definitely [00:26:00] took me out of the story more than like put me in. Sure. And so, that's just a different experience that we had with that. But I wanna go back to things that I liked. 'cause those things are kind of like popping back into my head.
Oh, great. Lovely. So happy to hear it was, I did love , the mystery of the whole mm-hmm. Like, what are we uncovering? Mm-hmm. And like, why do we have to get these keys and mm-hmm. All of that. I did enjoy that. And then I did enjoy the uncovering of the history of why mm-hmm. Harrow exists mm-hmm.
And why Gideon exists. Mm-hmm. And so, for those of you who have not read this book, and you're just like, interested in our thoughts, and you're not gonna read it. So the ninth house basically lost 200 children around the time when Harrah was born. And no one really understands why. They say that it's because of a pandemic, right.
, It was a illness that killed all of the [00:27:00] children. And Harrow though lived and so did Gideon, and so there's this mystery around why did they live? And then also it's important to know that hero's parents died how, I don't know how many years ago when it start, the book starts.
Mm-hmm. But basically, do I have this right, Amanda? Is that she has been playing with their bones and keeping them alive mm-hmm. And making it look like they're still alive. Mm-hmm. So that she doesn't lose power or whatever it is. Mm-hmm. Okay. Yeah. And when I found that, I was like, is that real?
Is that really
Amanda: what's happening? Yeah. Yeah. Her parents took their own lives and yes, she knows that it would create a horrible amount of instability in the ninth house if people knew that their leaders were dead. So she's been kind of animating their corpses, essentially, to make people think they're still alive.
Kelsey: And then basically keeps them really isolated. Mm-hmm. And just , has them come out for very specific reasons. Mm-hmm. And that, [00:28:00] yeah, that's wild. Necromancy, but necromancy. Yep. So Gideon does not know what really happened, but Harrow we find out does.
Mm-hmm. And there's some people, I don't remember what house it was, but they're like, Gideon, why, you know, you haven't thought about why this happened and like, why you were the only one alive. And so basically that leads to Gideon, asking questions about , what happened and pondering like. Well, what the hell happened?
And Harrow eventually tells Gideon, and basically what happened was the, the parents basically they sucked the lives of all of these 200 children.
Amanda: Mm-hmm.
Kelsey: Killed them and put them essentially into Harrow because they wanted a necromancer child.
Mm-hmm. And this was even before Harrow was born. This was in order to conceive Harrow. Mm-hmm. They sucked the life of 200 children and killed them and made Harrow.
Amanda: Mm-hmm.
Kelsey: And so Harold knew this. [00:29:00] And the reason why she is so, mean and icky to Gideon and why they have such a horrible relationship up to a certain point is that she knows or.
Do you remember? It was like the parents were upset at Gideon because , she was a reminder that they did this or something like that. , I mean, Gideon. Gideon told Gideon survived.
Amanda: Yes, but Gideon basically Harold's mad at Gideon because Gideon ratted her out to her parents, that she went into the locked tomb and she wasn't supposed to.
And that was the reason why. And then that was the reason why Harold's parents took their own lives. And so, har has a lot of hate for Gideon from the beginning, but what
Kelsey: happened in the Locked tomb again?
Amanda: Did she find out the, this is how she found out the truth. She, she found out who was in the locked tomb was like this little girl who's going to be the downfall of the emperor.
Oh. Which was Gideon. [00:30:00] No,
Kelsey: who is it? Who's in the tube? You don't know. Oh my God. See, so this is the other thing that I did not like about this book. So Kelsey's still very confused, y'all. Yes. This book is a project like a freaking project. It's, I remember. So I did post a video about this where I was like, oh my God, I don't wanna read this book.
Kelsey 2.0: And I was like, maybe a fourth of the way through. Mm-hmm. And I was not understanding anything. Mm-hmm. And so
Kelsey: one person, well,
Kelsey 2.0: multiple people was like, listen to the audiobook. And I was like, already doing that. And then one person gave good advice, I thought, which was. I stopped trying to understand everything.
Yeah. And just went with what I did understand.
Kelsey: Mm-hmm. And kept reading. Yeah. And then she said, or he, I don't know who it was on TikTok, they said , then they read the next book, but then went back to the first book and read the first book again. Mm-hmm. And then that's when things made [00:31:00] sense and I was like, oh god, this, this, this freaking project.
This is
Amanda: definitely a book. That would make more sense, I think, on a reread for sure. Yeah. Which, which, I haven't done. But I did the same thing I think in the first half of the book because , it's a lot of information. You are learning a lot about how this world works and how everyone fits into it and their different roles.
Yeah. And I think if you spend too much time trying to sort it all out, you're one, not gonna enjoy the book. And two, a lot of it. I don't wanna say it doesn't matter, but you can still enjoy the book without having like this deep knowledge of all of these things. Yeah. And understanding. You really can, especially because once they get to the first house and they start going through the trials and like going, you know, unlocking doors and meeting other people, like Yeah.
That part I found quite enjoyable and easy to understand. And it's very fast paced.
Kelsey: I don't understand how Harrow unlocked the doors and things. Mm-hmm. But I understood she was moving through [00:32:00] like this.
Amanda: Mm-hmm.
Kelsey: I don't know. Escape room essentially.
Amanda: I was actually gonna say, I think Kelsey, people like this part because., They're basically in a giant escape room for like Yeah.
Kelsey: And people are
Amanda: getting murdered and like Yes, exactly. That's essentially it. And like trying to solve these puzzles to open more doors to get more information. Yeah. So I was like, Kelsey will probably like this part of the book, I hope. '
Kelsey: cause
Amanda: we both
Kelsey: love escape rooms, so I do really love escape rooms.
Yeah. But yeah, so no, there's a lot I still don't understand. Yeah. And like this tomb thing and how it, I don't know. But the parents killed themselves because, do you understand why?
Amanda: So they killed themselves because , their one job was to keep the locked tomb. Locked and not let that information out.
They failed in their duties because Harold got in there again, and Gideon told them this because she never liked her and wanted to get in trouble. And so like, once they [00:33:00] realized they had kind of failed in the one thing that they were supposed to do, they took their own lives. So again, just for a bit of context, there were eight houses.
The ninth house was created because they were meant to , go to this planet, essentially get this enemy of the emperor locked away in a tomb, and then they were all supposed to die. And that was supposed to be the end of it. But what they did, unbeknownst to the other houses as they actually, you know, ended up like living, having kids, and kind of creating this ninth house that wasn't supposed to be a ninth house.
Mm-hmm. And so yeah, , they took their own lives because that was the thing that they were supposed to do, you know, protect locked to keep it locked, and they didn't, and. They had some feelings about that.
Kelsey: Yeah. Yeah. Overwhelmed by shame and fear that their failure would lead to the apocalypse.
Yeah. They took their own lives. Yeah. Along with their cavalier, which is why Harrah Hark needed a cavalier Gideon. [00:34:00] Yeah.
Amanda (2): Mm-hmm. Because she didn't have one. And the other thing we Go ahead. Go ahead. I was just gonna say the other thing we haven't talked about, which is actually important, so Gideon is not like of the ninth house's.
We don't really, so that's know Gideon's origins we know that her mother came to the ninth house with Gideon in an incubation tube. And the last thing that Gideon remembers are people who got Gideon remember, is like this woman saying Gideon multiple times, which is how she got her name.
Yes. So she is not really an official member of this. Ninth house. And so she's kind of a, a servant almost. She's definitely like an mm-hmm. Oppressed member of this Yes group. And it's why at the beginning of the novel she's trying to escape, right? Mm-hmm. She wants her freedom. Mm-hmm. 'cause she's kind of bound to this house and she hates it there.
Mm-hmm. So we didn't really talk about that. But she isn't just another member, like official member of the ninth house that Harrow was like, yes, come be My Cavalier. Which is similar to the other houses. Right. Because, you know, some of the other pairings, air in Cavalier in the other homes, like they're, you know, their [00:35:00] husband and wife are like, they're, you know, they're married couples, twin twins, right.
Twins. So, you know, they're all kind of official members of their house, whereas Gideon and Harrow don't have that dynamic. Mm-hmm. Like she's very much Gideon's, very much hero's subordinate in like all the ways. Mm-hmm. Yeah. So just wanted to clarify.
Kelsey: Also, do we know how many people are in the ninth.
In total, like all the adults that are still living after, after the children died. So, but did all of their children die or was it like oh two, just 200 of their children. And then, then everybody else is still alive. You know what I mean? I think all of its children died. Okay. Like the, like the ninth. At this point,
Amanda: when the book starts, ninth house is dying.
Like all of the kids have died. Got it. They're not reproducing any more. Yeah. And so it's officially in decline. Got it. Okay. Yeah.
Kelsey: See this? Yeah. That point would not have known. One of the other things that confused me [00:36:00] was all of the nicknames. Oh God. Yeah. That Harrow Hark. And I think Gideon only has two, but I can't, I don't know.
Mm-hmm. So it's Gideon and then Brittle. And I was like, what the fuck is griddle? And then Harrow, oh my God. Harrow Row Hark. What they call her? The Reverend daughter as well? Mm-hmm. Oh my God. I was like, who are these people? And I didn't understand that her last name was, what did you say? NSUs. NSUs.
Because they also just call her that as well. Mm-hmm. I didn't know that was her last name. Oh, and Nav for Gideon. I didn't know that was Gideon's last name either. So it was Gideon Nav and Griddle. Mm-hmm. And also, where does griddle come from? I don't know. It kind of options for them. And I'm Russian literature
Amanda: were every character has eight different names and you're like, wait, who is, wait, who am I reading about?
Yes. [00:37:00]
Kelsey: Oh my God. I don't know. It's, it's insane. Yeah. So that, that threw me. Mm-hmm. Or like three-fourths of the book.
Amanda: Mm-hmm.
Kelsey: It was a lot.
Amanda: It is a lot of information to keep track, which again, is why I'm so surprised that you were able to do this book as an audio book.
Because I was, as I was reading, I was constantly going back to the list of houses and characters and going back a couple pages to reference , whatever, like this particular term. And obviously you can't do that with an audio book. So I, I, I don't know how you did that. I also had the
Kelsey: book.
So like, I, I had it as well, so I would able to go back to it or reference it. Okay. But this is like, basically this is the map of the world and I was just like. Why does Amanda like this book? Because it was, there's so much intense, like work you have to put in for this. I know, I know. Freaking book.
And I was like, really? And, and, and honestly like
Amanda: that is the reason why [00:38:00] this book isn't getting a rave, like I said, five out of five for me because that is what I don't like about fantasy. I don't like when there's all of this front loading and like I mentioned with Legend Born, where I feel like I need to go and take a course to understand all of the inner workings of this world and the magic systems and the characters before I even begin the story.
Like it's quite exhaustive because I, again, I truly did not start to enjoy myself in this book until the second half. I didn't like. Yeah. Yeah.
Kelsey: Well, I have a, these book, this book is way more intense than any of the books I've had you read, which.
Solidifies the fact that you are going to read when the moon hatched. Okay. 'cause you made me read this book. Okay. But I'll, and that was the book that I had to read twice. Remember?
Amanda: I will, yes. I remember. I will also say the reason why is because, like you also have me mostly read romantic and romantic leans more into the romance side of it versus fantasy.
'cause like real [00:39:00] fantasy is like this and that's why I don't read it because it is like, yes. Like here are three pages of maps and here are the eight different, houses or whatever. And all of their mini characters and their different names and how they wield their magic, which I don't enjoy.
'cause I'm like, this feels like homework and I don't wanna have to think this hard. Or at least in this way because I feel like, I think when I read I don't wanna think in this way when I'm reading. But I think I know that this book really hit home for me. W when I had such a strong reaction to the ending, like that was a punch to the gut and I was destroyed.
I was utterly destroyed by the end of this book, not the epilogue, the act like the end, end. And for those of you who didn't read the book I know Kelsey mentioned this in the summary, but Yes. Yeah. Gideon sacrifices her life so that Harold can Live. And I think up until the very end I was like, no, it's, it's gonna work out.
Like she's gonna find a way to like, not have to, I'm like, they [00:40:00] just finally came together and realize that they care about each other and have a good relationship. Mm-hmm. There's no way, Gideon's gone forever and who knows, like I haven't read any of the other books in the series. And technically Gideon's Soul is still alive inside of Hero.
Mm-hmm. So she does still exist within her, within Hero's Body. Yeah. And Gideon's body goes missing at the end. So Yeah. Interesting. There's also a sense of like. Mystery and like, maybe there is a chance, right. That Gideon will mm-hmm. Reappear in future books. But I, I think I might've actually cried at the end.
I'm trying to remember now. 'cause it was a while ago, but it really got me,
Kelsey: it did not get me,
I was just, I, I also don't feel strongly about their relationship because it, I loved it. It's almost like a really awful,, abusive relationship actually. So I [00:41:00] didn't feel like drawn to it. Mm-hmm. Which is why I think , it leans towards dark romance. Which some people really love, you know?
Yeah. But I see that, I guess. Yeah. Yeah. Harrow keeps Gideon trapped, treats her like shit, and then sucks her
Amanda: life
Kelsey: worse when she needs to. Yes. And Gideon is just like, yeah, I'm your servant. Like, all you have to do is ask me, but okay.
Amanda (2): Yes. But I think the reason why it didn't feel as ick as some other dark romance is because Gideon, is not afraid to shoot off at the mouth and do what she wants when she can.
Right. , She's not just this submissive whimpering, like, okay. Like, like she holds her own. And so for me, I think that helped it to feel a little less, like yes, there's a power dynamic there mm-hmm. Where Har holds the majority of the power. Yeah. But also Gideon is the fighter. Like Gideon is the one who actually has this kind of physical prowess Yes.
In a way that does like hair can fight, but.
Kelsey: [00:42:00] Which I find so funny is that comparison between the Necromancers and the Cavaliers mm-hmm. Isn't that like it's said multiple times throughout the book? Is that the necromancers have noodles for arms. Arms? Because they don't, they don't use their muscles as much.
Yeah. 'cause they're using their brain to control the Right. The bones. Right, right. And the skeleton, ghosts and whatever. But then, but then of course the Cavaliers have to be strong. Mm-hmm. And while Gideon is, she prefers like the long blade or something, but then over her sword into every Pierre whatever C Cavaliers have like smaller swords.
Yeah. Like, I don't, I don't know. There's something there. Yeah. That.
Amanda: Yeah. She had had to learn before they left, before Harrow and Cian left to go to the trials at the first house. Uhhuh, she had to train for three months with a smaller sword. And I am not a sword person. I think it's a rapier. I think it's, that's how you say it.
I don't she's used to using a much larger, like an [00:43:00] actual sword, like a long sword of broad sort or something. So she had to reconfigure the fighting skills that she had. Yeah. But yeah, she's a, she's a very skilled fighter. And so I think again, it, it did give a little bit more balance to the power dynamic.
And so I think it made it a little, like I said, a little less uncomfortable for me. Mm. And yeah, again, I think Gideon's absolute disregard for like authority and all of the ways that she was able to, without fully undoing their relationship, um mm-hmm. As Cavalier Necromancer I don't know. I, I found it really entertaining and I liked her chutzpah.
So,
Kelsey: so I, I also found it entertaining and I just wanted to point that out. Yeah. Like, also it didn't feel like a great grand loving sacrifice because of their relationship. It just didn't, oh, see, I feel, didn't land for me that way.
Amanda: Like, see, for me, it, it had that much more depth and meaning to it because they had such a [00:44:00] troubled fractious relationship.
And so for them to work their way through all of that and get to a point where she's literally willing to die for this other woman, I think it, it had held a lot more weight than if they were like, oh my gosh, you're the greatest ever, like the entire book. And we have like this loving, deep relationship.
Like, that's also great. Love that. I also probably would've cried, but for me it just had a different, yeah, it had a different weight to it because of the journey that they had to go through to get there. It was this very, hard one or hard fought love, and I like really liked that.
Kelsey: I did also didn't feel the love, I guess, in the writing, and so I, I just was less attached.
And also I, yeah, go ahead. So, sorry. The fact that Gideon died also went over my head at the end. Oh. Oh, you didn't realize. Oh, whatever
Amanda: she was,
Kelsey: and then I only realized it in the epilogue and I was like, oh, wait, what the fuck? And so I had no emotional reaction because of that. Well, you, you weren't sure what happened as well.
I was like, Harold was, was [00:45:00] gonna die, but then Gideon's like, no, you can do thi. I was like, okay. I don't know.
Amanda: Mm.
Kelsey: Okay. That's valid. The
Amanda: whole ending. I'll go back though to the point about the relationship feeling you know, maybe they didn't care for each other 'cause there was so much.
But I, I think it kind of reminded me of, oh my God, what, , I don't know, like a middle school relationship where you really do like someone, but instead of saying nice things, you're always ridiculing them and I don't know, putting things in their locker. Like I don't, you know what I mean?
Yes. Like it's very, especially like a middle school boy, like he's not gonna come out and be like, yeah, I like you. He's gonna do all these things to , make your life miserable. So for me, even though they were treating each other horribly, I thought it was really clear that they had feelings for each other.
Oh. Especially because, and we didn't talk about this that much either. Like Gideon clearly has. Feelings for dl or who mm-hmm. Who we think is Doey, who's actually this other person called Ria, I think is her name. Yeah. I think that's how you pronounce it. I have no idea. 'cause I did not listen to the audio book.
I know how say that name, but DOL is right. Okay. [00:46:00] So she has feelings for dl and it is very clear that Harold does not like this. And Hero. Yeah. Harrow has feelings about Gideon having feels for another woman. Mm-hmm. So, again, , I think there's lots of indicators along the way that there's , feelings brewing, there's tension.
Sure. There's like some sexual tension. Again, love a slow burn. I also like Enemies to Lovers, which is like bo they're both in there, so, mm-hmm. I, I don't know. I was here for it,
Kelsey: but nothing even happens with them. Like, they just like, which is fine. I don't, it kind, I don't need it. I don't need the, like, they don't even necessarily like, I don't know, do they fully say.
That they have feelings for one another. They don't. Right? ,
Amanda: So there's one part in the book. It's this really famous line that's , very much associated with this book in this series, which is one flesh, one end.
And I, do they ever say that to each other? I feel like they do at the end, which is their way of saying , I love you. You know, like you're, you're it essentially, I thought they said [00:47:00] that to each other. 'cause they found that statement in one of the locked rooms, right? Oh
Kelsey: wait. Yeah, but also at the end, I'm looking at one of the last pages and Okay.
Harrow said with some difficulty, I cannot conceive a universe without you in it. Yes you can. It's just less great and less hot. Said Gideon. Yes. I love that line. Harrow Hark said Gideon, the nine someday you'll die and get buried in the ground and we can work this out then. Yeah. For now. I can't say you'll be fine.
I can't say we did the right thing. I can't tell you shit. I'm basically a hallucination produced by your brain chemi chemistry, while coping with the massive trauma of splicing in my brain chemistry. Even if I wasn't, I don't know Jack Harrow. I never did, except for one thing.
Amanda: Yeah. Anyway, they're basically, I can just see them like growing into these two crotty old lesbians, you know, who just rag on each other all the time, but love each other so much.
You know what I mean? I really [00:48:00] liked the relationship and I liked that it wasn't just this, because, you know, and a lot of your, the romantic novels that you had me read, like even in the Enemies to Lovers one, like their banter is not like this. No, absolutely not. And I appreciated this level of angst and antagonism between the two of them.
I just, yeah, it just landed well for me and I thought it was hilarious. The links to which they were going to hide what they were actually feeling. And even when they are telling each other how they feel, it's still in this very kind of coded way.
Kelsey: I feel like this is the I don't know.
It seemed like Gideon was already inside Harrow. She was in this part, is that right? She was, yeah. Yeah. Okay. Yeah, they're just funny, like, like this line. It just says Harrow said I cannot do this. You already did it, said, Gideon, it's done. You ate me and rebuilt me. We can't go home again. I can't bear it.
[00:49:00] Suck it down, said Gideon, you're already 200 dead daughters and sons of our house. What's one more
Amanda: like Exactly. Like I said, Gideon does not give a fuck. She's so I keep on using the same word 'cause it's so perfect. Like she's so irreverent and mm-hmm. I, I love, like, honestly, the reason why I like this book as much as I do is because of Gideon.
I just think she is such a great character. I enjoyed spending time with her and walking through this crazy, weird adventure with her and her sense of humor and her interactions with both Harrow and the other folks from the other houses. Mm-hmm. That is what sold me on this book was Gideon. It wasn't like all of the other Yeah.
Extenuating circumstances. It wasn't even the world itself or all of the the dense kind of content that pops up at different points. Mm-hmm. It was Gideon and then it was their time in Canaan house and their trials and adventures. Like you know me, love a good trial, love an escape room, love puzzles.
Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm. Love things Gideon uncovered. So it [00:50:00] was a, a riotous. Good time.
Kelsey: Yeah. Well I don't think I have much more to say on this. Alright.
Amanda: We covered a lot. We did. And as always, I'm sure things will come up when we get to our reviews as well. Yes, yes. But since you are sort of a little bit on the fence about this book, maybe you didn't absolutely hate it. Is this a book that you would recommend?
No.
Kelsey: Okay. I was trying to think of like what audience I would recommend it to. I, I don't know.
Amanda: Okay. I dunno, I would certainly recommend this to fans of fantasy. I think if you are a fantasy lover and your someone, again, who enjoys one of the things you enjoy about fantasy, you know, are books that kind of mm-hmm.
Do a lot with like, world building and talking through the magic system and how it all works. If you like that aspect of fantasy, this book will be a breeze for you because you're really used to doing that in your, your normal course of [00:51:00] reading and you get like a really stellar main character in my opinion.
So I, I like gi, I do, yeah. I do think fans of fantasy would like this book, so I would recommend it to fantasy lovers. I think most of my friends are not fantasy lovers. Yeah. So I don't know that I would recommend it to anyone that I know personally, but. If you're listening to this podcast and fantasy is your jam, I highly recommend that you check this book out for sure.
And also this podcast episode will make so much more sense. Yes, if you do. But yeah, let's get to our literally the best or literally the worst. I've got my one star reviews from Good Reads, Kelsey, I have one star. Sorry, I've got five star reviews. Okay. She looks like Amanda. What? I've got five star reviews from Good Reads.
Kelsey got one star who actually have five stars. One star. Yes. I actually have five stars. Okay, good. I promise I did it the right way this time. So that means Kelsey's gonna start and I will , go second. And, there's a little bit of a surprise with my first one that I'll tell you when we get there.
Oh, okay. That I think you'll find interesting. My
Kelsey 2.0: first one is the longest one. Okay. So, Gideon the [00:52:00] ninth this is from Matt's fantasy book. My disappointment is immeasurable and my day is ruined . The world building is extremely shallow, which was especially frustrating because the foundation that is laying out at the beginning of the book had a lot of promise.
I wanted to know about the world the characters we're living on, why there are different schools of necromancy. The details of the ongoing war and the reason for the collapsing empire. I got none of that and was rather quickly thrown into a game of clue. Instead.
Kelsey: Gideon herself is most certainly in my top three least favorite POV characters in fantasy that I've ever read. While she has a compelling backstory that gets revelations later. In the book, her personality can be described as extremely edgy teenager. Everything she says is either sarcastic, full of contempt, trying to be too cool, [00:53:00] get ready for plenty of uses of dope and other similar uses of complex vocabulary or some combination of the above.
So, , those were the two pieces that I took from Matt's.
Amanda: Interesting. It's, it sounds like based on this person's handle, like Matt's fantasy books, I think is what you said. Yes. And their first remark work, we both, you and I felt like there was too much information already and he wanted more, right?
Yeah. He wanted even more of the, I guess, exposition and, and laying down the foundations for this world, which again, as a non fantasy reader, was like, I was already overwhelmed. I think if they laid even more information on there, I would've been . Done and dusted from the first couple chapters.
I also think this is a book or a series that those questions are annoyances he had, would be addressed in the second book if he stuck with it.
Kelsey: Because obviously hero's gonna be [00:54:00] working with the emperor, so you're gonna get more of a
Amanda: expanded view. Exactly. We're gonna like zoom out a little bit to see what's going on.
Mm-hmm. And you know, I, I can understand his comments about Gideon, like it being like, okay, we get the snark. Yes. Like it's, she's on all the time. She's on 100 all the time with the snark. Yeah. I just happen to really enjoy that, but I could see that being annoying to, that was the only part I liked.
Yeah. I again,
Kelsey: I was just like, this is funny. It makes, it's making you laugh. Yes, exactly. There was something else I wanted to say about this. Oh, I wasn't overwhelmed by the amount of information it. Was the writing for me. Okay. That I didn't like. Okay. And the way that things were presented.
Gotcha. So it was the writing style, not the content necessarily writing that was writing style. Yeah. I feel like, yeah.
Amanda: That's fair. Your turn. So this is really interesting. So what this, this first five star review is actually from an author and it is an author, Ooh. That Kelsey knows and loves. Ooh, who is it?
And it's someone we've read on this podcast as well. It [00:55:00] is Rebecca Rhos, who is the author of Trail of Lightning that we read last fall. Yeah. And she loved this book. And this is what Rebecca Roanhorse had to say. Stunningly good. A brilliant and original mashup of genres. The story is brimming with memorable characters, acerbic, dark humor, a unique magic system space travel decaying technology and layers upon layers of mystery.
It is the gothic space adventure. I didn't know I needed, so if you don't take my word for it, take Rebecca Rohn horse's. Word for it. Thanks Rebecca. I love her describing it as a gothic space adventure. 'cause Yeah, it, it is such a perfect way to summarize it. Yeah.
Kelsey: Alright. This one comes from Jake Bishop.
Ah, it's done. This is not terribly written, but I really, really did not like it. I have enjoyed reading textbooks more, my least favorite book of the year.
Amanda (2): Oh, wow. [00:56:00] Okay. The thing is, like, again, if he read the whole book, the second half of the book is, does not read like a textbook. The first half maybe, but I, I don't get that from the second half.
Anyhow, okay, so this is my long one. Okay. And this is from Helen, 2.04 and a half Stars, the perfect book club pick. It's fast-paced and witty with sprinkles of mystery, atmospheric horror and body horror, a little bit of romance. Two, I had so many crackpot theories that I constructed and discarded while reading.
In short, there was tons to talk through with my book club, and we all loved it. The fast pace was a big plus for me, since I get bored very easily. Gideon the ninth gives you no time to breathe between events. Ever. At the same time, the world and the magic system is actually quite complicated. This means that I was perpetually confused but wildly entertained.
The ensemble cast also had me perpetually just a little lost. There's a list of houses and characters in the front of the [00:57:00] paperback copy as well as a glossary and naming index in the back. Yes, I had to check both frequently because I constantly lost track of who was in which house doing what for whom RIP to anyone listening to the audiobook who couldn't reference the supplementary guides Tanza mirror's narration style is pure genius.
She is so effortlessly funny. The third person narration is sometimes very close to Gideon's thoughts and sometimes steps back to tease Gideon and give us a broader view of the story. The romance was gorgeous. It took me a while to warm up to Gideon and Harrow as a romantic pair because there was a clear power dynamic between them at first that made me a little uncomfortable.
But Tam's and Mirror does an absolutely incredible job at turning that dynamic on its head throughout the story, and I was a thousand percent on board after that quote. Strike me down. You've won. I've lived my whole wretched life at your mercy. Yours alone. And God knows I deserve to die. at Your hand.
You're my only friend. I am undone without you, [00:58:00] unquote. Oh my God. Wow. Why say I love you when you can say that? Can't wait to be just as confused and entertained by book two like this. The reason why I included it, and I know it's long, is because, yeah, I feel like she said. My exact thoughts on this book.
So well down to the like it was, what did she say? I was perpetually confused but wildly entertained. Like that was my experience of this book I was constantly referencing. Yeah, the glossaries and the index and all of that and was often confused but I still had a really great time and again, I love their romance and I love that quote.
So
Kelsey: the last quote that you shared where Gideon's like, you're my only friend. Well yeah because you're a fricking prisoner of the night, the house essentially. Like you didn't have opportunity to make friends. She made some
Amanda: friends sort of when she got to Canaan house. Oh my
Kelsey: god. Yeah. Also Benito needed to come say hi.
Hi Beni. I look, I just like see his [00:59:00] eyes. He's just like, say hi.
Amanda: Hi. Beni though. He me out. The cutest, our little midnight doggo.
Kelsey: I know you can barely see you. Just blends in. It's great. Okay, my next review. Comes from Lena. This is the story of upper class teenagers in a haunted house and the poor baars that have to service them.
It's told from the point of view of an abuse servant who vacillates between wrath and slavish, hope for appreciation. It was depressing. It was an unlabeled ya, it was wall-to-wall teenagers. I want my time back.
Amanda: I, it's interesting because I, I did not think of this book as ya ever, which is interesting because, I mean, Gideon does act like a teenager.
Yes. But I, I, I would've never classified it that way. But I, I'm
Kelsey: curious if any of my students have ever read this book.
Amanda: Yeah. Yeah, I, I could certainly see my students having [01:00:00] Reddit for sure, but I just, mine are middle schoolers only, so no, that, yeah, that's true. I could see my high schoolers having Reddit, but I don't know.
I did like her description of it as what is it a haunted house full of upper class teenagers? Yes. I mean, she's not wrong or they're not wrong. I don't know their gender, but they're not wrong. Okay, next one. Okay. This is from a foray in fantasy. What was that ending with like eight question marks?
The first sci-fi book I have ever enjoyed celebration emoji. This is how you do enemies to lovers, my God. And they have a crap emoji after every word. Mm. The relationships were just so good. The middle 50% was absolute perfection. My God, Gideon is, God is probably one of my new favorite characters. The last 25% was just crazy and maybe a little too rushed.
All of the characters were so complex, but they all felt alive or undead. Gideon's humor is absolutely hilarious, but I apparently missed half of the [01:01:00] references. I need more Gideon slash Harrow. The next book better give it to me. And then it says, first reread notes. Loved it even more. There were so many bits of foreshadowing that I missed the first time around.
Mm-hmm. Also solidified that I am an e Anhy simp. So there's that.
Kelsey: I anhy, oh my God. That just, we didn't really talk
Amanda: about
Kelsey: Yeah. The various characters. I don't even, what house was she
Amanda: from? I dunno. Oh God. I don't know off the top of my head, to be perfectly honest. I don't have, I don't have the reference in front of me to to know.
And also, I don't
Kelsey: know, like what she, she's in the third house. Okay. Air to the house of the third princess of Ida. Yeah. Because she's kind of a badass. Yeah. If I remember correctly. I don't really know. I don't remember anything about her. Oh, in the back of the book, it gives you some descriptors of the houses.
Oh yeah. Okay. Yeah. Athe is 21.
Amanda: Yeah. 'cause I was gonna say, they're not all teenagers, which is again, why I [01:02:00] didn't think, but they are
Kelsey: young. They are. Oh my God. I mean,
Amanda: well, there's also a married couple. You know,
Kelsey: there's a 13-year-old that was there.
Amanda: Yeah, the little, what's it's the boy,
Kelsey: right? Yeah, it's, yeah.
Darren. Yeah. 27, 22. Yeah. They're not, they're pretty young. Yeah, but they're not all teenagers. Wait, how old is Harrow and,
Amanda: I would say they're probably like late teens, early twenties.
Kelsey 2.0: Anyway, this is my final one star review. From Kiki.
I really wanted to like this book, but after Muir's 500th loving description of a white character's eyes , their hair, the sweat at the hairline ad nauseum, but the two maybe black. It's not clear beyond them being intensely dark. Members of the second house were walking line sketches. This book could be nothing else but regret for me, white authors.
If this is the best you can do, please feel free to [01:03:00] leave us out of your little goth games. Thanks.
Amanda: Hmm. Interesting. Yeah, I wouldn't say that this, this fantasy book is necessarily very diverse or inclusive. Definitely not.
Kelsey: Yeah.
Amanda: You know this, I dunno, maybe this is a controversial thing to say because we've talked a lot about this, you know?
Of course. Of course. As a woman of color, I am here for. Diverse stories and mm-hmm. Including diverse characters from a variety of backgrounds, a variety of different identities at the same time, I don't think that there's anything wrong with having a, a story that has white characters in it. You know, like, I dunno.
Kelsey: But that's exactly what that person was saying though, was that if you can't include us in a meaningful way Yeah. Just don't,
Amanda: yeah. 'cause I guess if she's saying that the two, I don't, I honestly don't remember the descriptions of those two characters.
Mm-hmm. If it was just like, oh, like they're tan or whatever it was. But yes, if you are going to include them Yes. Make sure that there [01:04:00] aren't equal footing with all the other characters and are given mm-hmm. The same attention. And that they're fully fleshed out characters. Absolutely agree. Right.
And then at the same time, if it is just a book full of white characters, then whatever, like that is some people's experiences. Right. And I don't think there's anything wrong with that per se. Yeah, and I also think if that is your only comment about the book itself, like if it actually is a well-written story that is compelling and has important things to say and has good themes, et cetera, then it seems, I don't know, maybe a little narrow-minded to only focus on one aspect and then say that the book is a complete wash because of that.
I don't know. I have to think about that some more.
Kelsey: I, but that's just like
Amanda: my initial reaction.
Kelsey: I wonder, yeah, if that was just one thing that they put on paper, right? Like Yeah. And if there were other things that they didn't like. Yeah.
Amanda: Yeah. Mm-hmm. Perhaps. Okay. But let's end on a positive note. And so this last one is from Brittany.
Christine. Okay. I am done. We did it first, let me say, having flown through the last 200 pages, my struggle [01:05:00] in the first 200 was warranted. It takes a lot of work and searching for context and world building before you finally realize. None of it matters. I understand much better why no one has been able to summarize this book because to summarize it at all is to spoil it.
What I will say is that if you DNF in the first 150 pages, this is a one star book. If you get to 250 pages, it's a three star book. And if you do finish, if it is not exactly a five, it'll stick with you for the rest of your life. Now, a question to the author, are you okay to edit upon reread? This is my favorite book of all time.
It's meant to be reread. There was so much to be gained. I actually fully agree with that. I think if I had taken the time, I'm not a reread, but I feel like if I had taken the time to reread it mm-hmm. Knowing what I knew by the end, I would've had a much better overall reading experience and would've picked up on a lot more things.
Yeah. 'cause this book has a lot happening, but, so the question
Kelsey: is,
Amanda: [01:06:00] yeah.
Kelsey: Knowing that, would you have read it knowing you would have to read it twice to really understand the depth of this world? Yeah,
Amanda: I think so. I think so. 'Cause I still got a lot out of it, even on my first read through and enjoyed it.
Mm-hmm. A lot, like I said, with that, with that original person, like I was perpetually confused and wildly entertained and I am okay with our reading experience. Absolutely. With it. Yeah. So yeah, again, reader of readers, listeners, as always, if you've read this book and loved it or hated it. Let us know.
We'll have our voting video out on our socials on Thursday and you can let us know if this book was a lit it or quit Oh, quit for you. So be sure to chime in. We love getting those comments and seeing where folks land. And we didn't say this at the beginning of the podcast episode, and I'll have Kelsey do socials in a second, but don't forget to rate and review our podcast.
Oh, yeah. I like forgot to put that little blurb in there. Go do it.
Kelsey: Takes two seconds. Yeah. And you can come hang out with us on social media. We are very active on TikTok especially mm-hmm. At Live Vibes Only podcast [01:07:00] and on Instagram at Live Vibes only underscore podcast. And if you are so inclined to see Benito in the Flesh, kind of in the fur, Benito in the fur.
Then come hang out with us on YouTube where we're also live vibes only podcast. So lots of places to enjoy our content and enjoy. The books , we're reading. Yeah. And we'll see you next Monday. See you next Monday. Bye bye.